Imperial incursion problem

[Liquid_ocelot1]

All of my local enemies are Imperial (1 guard, 2 Space marine and one space wolf). I was wondering for what heavy support choices I should go for I have: two HH one ion (with SMS) one rail (with burst cannons) one sniper drone team and one broadside. What would be advisable to field against the space wolfs whom I am fighting on Friday :-'? 

[Boneguard]

Pieplates.

I would honestly say forget about the Ion head and field Railhead since you can pie plate.

On top of that I would recommand, CIB, AFP, Firestorm suits, Helios suits. And lots of mobile Fire warriors with devilfish.

[OMalley84]

Stealth Sniper Drones are GREAT V SMs.  My group is about 75% SM/CSM and I have had great success with the addition of 3 stealth sniper teams and 2 Railheads.  Commander Shas'O is CIB/PR, Its just soo many AP 3 shots

[Liquid_ocelot1]

Thanks to both of you with regard to the fire warriors should they have pulse rifles, pulse carbines or a fifty fifty mix (i can accommodate both). mmm AP3 power My Shas'o also CIB/PR

[OMalley84]

I use Pulse Rifles all the time, they are just very useful.  Carbines are nice but they 12 FW in the Dfish that jump out to finish a squad off (which is generally the only time a dedicated "run around" squad ever sees the light of day) with 24 shots is too valuable.  Plus 30" is awesome for popping the treads off of Rhino's n such (6's glance on side armor FTW) it happens. Earlier this week I was play testing 500 point and I shot a Rhino at 30" with FWs, 3 hits outta 5 (not all could range the tank) 1 glance and rolled a 6 (immobilized). I was soo happy.  I would be very surprised if there was NOTHING to shoot at from a stationary squad of FW.

[Boneguard]

Rifle.

Sure you lose assault, but you do not want to assault SM.
Sure you lose pinning, but with ATSKNF it's moot.

You have long range and at shorter range you have double the fire power, and since the str and ap is the same, it's better.

[Finn]

What's ATSKNF got to do with Pinning?

[Boneguard]

Doesn't ATSNKF grant Fearless??

If they are Fearless they cannot be pin.

[Railgun Convention]

Huh? Fearless? I wish...
 
It doesn't grant fearless; instead, units automatically regroup even if below half strength.
 
Anyway, despite that, pinning is still pointless; all SM have a leadership of at least 9 these days. And while the army wide Ld10 has gone, a lot of SM armies will have someone like Calgar as their special character; several of these characters have a sort of global fearless as opposed to combat tactics.

[Liquid_ocelot1]

You have long range and at shorter range you have double the fire power, and since the str and ap is the same, it's better.

thanks for the advice he (my opponent) does have a rhino and with this in mind maybe his squad will take that little bit longer to reach me hence more time to pour godlike firepower onto them!

[thedog90]

Yeah, don't underestimate rapid-firing fire warriors.  Charging forward as soon as the enemy gets too close can really suprise people.  Not to mention that it will usually take out at least half, if not more, of a tac squad by itself (meaning you should usually only attempt this if you have support).

I also agree with Boneguard:

Pieplates.

I once took out all but one of a full tac squad with just a single frag projector shot!  Granted, that was lucky, but that was obviously not the only gun in the crisis squad.  Just like with rapid-fire, the more dice the better.


P.S. - I almost envy you.  My store's been over-run by tyranids.  Not fun when you have a ranged-based army.

[Liquid_ocelot1]

P.S. - I almost envy you.  My store's been over-run by tyranids.  Not fun when you have a ranged-based army.

I have the same problem but with necrons as well, it is very annoying as now most of my friends are running secondary armies all of which are necron/tyrannid ! 

[OMalley84]

In my opinion, the first thing I target when playing Rhino-SM lists are the Rhinos.  There are soo many S 5+ weapons in the Tau army that you shouldn't have too much trouble killing a couple first turn.  If you go first thats great, but even if you go second and your opponent pops smoke, use any MLs to remove the cover bonus and you should be golden.  Do your opponents use alot of Drop Pods or Land Speeders?  The Land Speeders need to go too but just about EVERY shot is glancing on 5 against them.  I have experienced those two units needing to die first.  Good luck and good hunting

[Finn]

Doesn't ATSNKF grant Fearless??

If they are Fearless they cannot be pin.

Quote of the Day: Know thy foe.

P.S. - I almost envy you.  My store's been over-run by tyranids.  Not fun when you have a ranged-based army.

I have the same problem but with necrons as well, it is very annoying as now most of my friends are running secondary armies all of which are necron/tyrannid ! 

I wouldn't be surprise. They are, after all, next line for getting a 5th Edition update.

[Liquid_ocelot1]

1)If you go first thats great, but even if you go second and your opponent pops smoke, use any MLs to remove the cover bonus and you should be golden. 
2)Do your opponents use alot of Drop Pods or Land Speeders?  The Land Speeders need to go too but just about EVERY shot is glancing on 5 against them.  I have experienced those two units needing to die first. 
3)Good luck and good hunting

1) Gotta love those pathfinders
2) Unfortunately one of my friends/imperial scum opponents is a dark angel so yes drop pods and land speeders
3) thanks
4) Noob question alert what does pieplates mean?

[OMalley84]

Pie plate is Lg Blast template

[Liquid_ocelot1]

Pie plate is Lg Blast template

And the tau use them to their full advantage !

[thedog90]

Yeah, our hammerheads can drop them just about anywhere on the table.  Kind of hard to hide from.

[Mick @ Wargaming247.com]

We're happy to announce that we're opening a new walk in store at our warehouse and will be launching at the end of October 2011. We're based in Buntingford, Hertfordshire, right next to the A10 and have free parking for customers.

We'll be selling the usual Games Workshops products but will also be stocking the full Mantic range as well as lots of other war games systems, standalone boardgames, and card gaming systems.

We're calling it The Games Bunker and it will be themed as a futuristic war bunker (well, our take on it anyway!) and should be a good place for you to visit as we'll have gaming tables and painting areas in store as well as a large range of the more independent games that you'll be able to touch and play for the first time.

So, as we want to build a bricks and mortar store that gamers would like to come to, I would love to hear any suggestions you may have.

• What makes you want to go to a store? Is it based on price? Or a good vibe about the place?
• what would you like to see going on in the store?
• do you like to be emailed weekly and told what's going on or do you get enough of these emails from retailers already and would prefer a more off-hands approach generally?
• what products would you like to see in a store that you can't buy at a Games Workshop store?
• what lines would you like us to stock?
• how far do you have to travel to the nearest high street shop to buy what you're after?
• how far are you prepared to travel and what would it take to encourage you to pop in and see us?
• In store events - do these encourage you to come in?
• Should we run a gaming club? Perhaps with extra discount for members?
• Would you like late night opening during the week? Maybe so you could pop in after work for instance?

I would really value some honest feedback and I know I'm asking a lot of questions but if anyone has any comments to make on any of these items I'd love to hear them!

[Restayvien]

What makes you want to go to a store? Is it based on price? Or a good vibe about the place?

When I was really into wargaming, it was the models on display, and the awesome gaming tables that keep me coming back. As well as the local wargaming community and regular casual games. However what kept me buying was good prices. Once they went up, I stopped buying. And you can only maintain interest in a hobby you can't afford for so long, even if the models are great. All the above goes towards a good vibe - staff that are actively involved in the hobby for their own enjoyment that are happy to sit and paint with you and chat, without trying to sell you things constantly (those were the days!), really make you feel like part of something.

what would you like to see going on in the store?

Everything I can suggest you've probably thought of already, but a quick list would be:
- Intro games
- Tables for friends to come in and use for various games
- Friendly campaigns and competitive tournaments
- Painting/modelling tutorials
- Competitions (painting, modelling etc), maybe put winners entries on display
- House rules (and maybe even silly fun games using house rules, i.e. squiq farm survival )
- -->!!!Specialist games!!!<--
- Sales. Seriously. In normal retail sales are commonplace, but you rarely see them in hobby stores these days. When I was younger I remember GW having a sale day, and something like 200 people turned up to this tiny little store, there were buckets of paints for 30p each and all the models I couldn't afford normally were suddenly within my financial reach. The Christmas sale was an absolute frenzy too.

do you like to be emailed weekly and told what's going on or do you get enough of these emails from retailers already and would prefer a more offhand approach generally?

I guess an opt-in newsletter isn't a bad thing.

what products would you like to see in a store that you can't buy at a Games Workshop store?

Cheaper terrain and better value materials and tools for scratch-building. Small amounts of electrical parts for conversions maybe? And again, specialist games.

what lines would you like us to stock?

Can't really say, the only wargame I ever really got into was 40k. I used to play a fair bit of Magic the Gathering too, and from what I've seen there is some overlap between the two communities.

how far do you have to travel to the nearest high street shop to buy what you're after?

I used to have to go to Oxford (about 18 miles away) by bus, so purchases were few and far between. When I was much younger and first into 40k it was only a 5 minute walk down the road to GW. These days I don't wargame at all, but when I did a year or two ago I just ordered online because it was cheaper (25% discount) and more convenient.

how far are you prepared to travel and what would it take to encourage you to pop in and see us?

N/A see above. If I had a car AND was still gaming, I'd say 30 miles is about the top limit, if there was a great club and I had friends there. Just to make a quick purchase though, I think 10 miles max (if I had transport).

In store events - do these encourage you to come in?

Not really. They did a bit when I was younger, but I generally preffered to take a friend, turn up and be able to play a casual unarranged game there and then with whoever was around (arbitrated by a staff member if there was one free, sometimes they even joined in). The problem with 'events' was that people were too unreliable. You'd turn up with an army and be the only one there that day. Or too many would show up and there wouldn't be room for you.

Should we run a gaming club? Perhaps with extra discount for members?

Yes to the first and..maybe, to the second. I haven't run a store so I don't know if it would be economical. I think having good gaming tables (and maybe some small in-store armies for people to use if they don't have enough models) is enough incentive for members to keep coming back. And people who can't join the club might feel put out that they have to pay more.

Would you like late night opening during the week? Maybe so you could pop in after work for instance?

A very good idea. Being open during work hours only is a bizarre modus operandi I've never understood. Ideally if there's enough demand you want people to be able to turn up at 6 and have a decent 2-3 hour game without having to pack up halfway through.



On top of the above I would also definitely recommend some kind of instore ordering system (prefferably an electronic catalogue) so that people can browse all your ranges easily or look for specific parts. Or at least have a catalogue on a shelf of parts you could order in. The option of home or in-store pickup is handy too. That's how I used to order all my BFG stuff from GW. I always wished they had an electronic (searchable!) copy though, which would have saved a lot of page-flipping and form-filling!


I hope that's slightly useful to you! Good luck with the store, I wish you all the best!

[Jonagon]

I echo much of what Restayvien said, my max travel time for a regular club is probably 30 mins in the car, which depends on the roads and whatnot. At about 80 mins travel time away from me, you're probably a bit too far away for me.

Stores i'll visit only occasionally to buy stuff, i'll travel further for, for example I'm planning to do so to pick up a bunch of PP minis, but that's a twice a year kinda frequency.

EDIT: Good for you for getting a store though!

Whilst I'm here, one other little comment, you have your White Dwarf offer which I think is great, the thing which has stopped me taking it up so far, is that it seems to take a long time for you to get the issues up on the Web. Unless I'm mistaken your website is currently only showing up to the June issue, when the October issue will be out in a couple of days.

[Masked Thespian]

• What makes you want to go to a store? Is it based on price? Or a good vibe about the place?

Price is certainly something to look at in this day and age of online discounts, but that is the problem that all brick and mortar shops must face.  The fact that you already offer discounts is good in that respect.

Appearance seems like a must, to me.  Cleanliness and brightness make the store appealing, especially to the random customers you'd get off of the street rather than the die-hard gamers.  Since you've said that you want to make the interior look like a sci-fi bunker, I'd suggest a scheme reminiscent of the white corridors of the Tantive IV from Star Wars Episode 4.

One big thing, to me, is staff members that are friendly but not in your face (like Games Workshop ones are).  It's one thing to need help, but it's completely another thing to be set upon as soon as you step in the store.  At the other end of the spectrum, staff members who look (and/or smell) like they haven't showered in weeks and/or couldn't care less that you've got £200 of product in your hands whilst they talk to their friends can be very off-putting.

Not sure what your floor space is going to be like, but I'd suggest a small amount of seating for long-suffering significant others/parents.

• what would you like to see going on in the store?

I think the best things that stores can offer, other than playing space, are ways to enhance the social aspect of the hobby.  Events, campaigns, painting tutorials, or any other thing like that are something that people cannot really get from the internet.

A little bit of wall space dedicated to this, such as posters for upcoming events, a space for a campaign board, and other things like that, would also help.

• do you like to be emailed weekly and told what's going on or do you get enough of these emails from retailers already and would prefer a more off-hands approach generally?

Again, if you did this sort of thing, I'd suggest emphasising the events you are running in store rather than upcoming releases.  The option to opt-in would be better than being forcibly added and having to opt-out (though you'd need to press people to do this if you did).

• what products would you like to see in a store that you can't buy at a Games Workshop store?

Assuming you are not talking about non-miniature wargames, I'd suggest third party products.  Things like Gale Force Nine's templates, tools, modelling materials, and things like that.

• what lines would you like us to stock?

On a personal note; on your website, there's a glaring omission in the lack of having the core Warhammer Fantasy and Warhammer 40,000 Rulebooks.  You have Island of Blood and Assault on Black Reach, but sometimes people want the core books on their own.

As for other lines, you seem to have a handle on wargaming.  But have you considered branching out into non-wargaming lines?  Board games (like what you can get from Fantasy Flight Games) and non-collectible card games (such as Munchkin or Zombies!!!) are often quite popular with the sort of customers you're looking to attract.

• how far do you have to travel to the nearest high street shop to buy what you're after?

Heh.  Pretty sure I'm going to skew your results for this one.  I live about 100km away from my closest gaming store, which is in Tokyo.  That's a good 3 hours or so by train and subway, so I rarely get to go.

Whilst I lived in England, my closest stockist was around 8 miles away and the closest store with a gaming area was around 12 miles away.

• how far are you prepared to travel and what would it take to encourage you to pop in and see us?

Generally, I'd probably frequent a store that was within a one hour travel radius of me, and that would depend on the local travelling conditions.  Much further than that and a trip to a gaming store becomes a rare, treasured event rather than something I'd consider doing every week.

• In store events - do these encourage you to come in?

Oh yes.  These would certainly encourage me to come in.

• Should we run a gaming club? Perhaps with extra discount for members?

Reiterating what I said earlier, a gaming club would certainly enhance the social aspect of the hobby.  Not sure what you ought to do regarding the discount idea.

• Would you like late night opening during the week? Maybe so you could pop in after work for instance?

Oh yes.  Definitely.  Even if it were only one or two days a week, late openings are a very good idea for those people who can't always get in during office hours.

[The Man They Call Jayne]

I like being able to go into a store and have it feel like a very sociable place. I do on occasion go into a GW on weekends without my own army and enjoy watching other people play, talk with them about their armies and tactics and so on. The staff are ok with it and they don't ask you to leave if your not buying anything right then.

Thats were price comes in. Id be happier buying things when i went in if it didnt empty my wallet for a single blister.

Best of Luck

[Wargamer]

The thing that really, really puts me off about GW these days is that I feel like I'm being sold to. I really, really hate their banter.

What I would really like would be a store where the staff care in the way hobbyists care; they are there to give honest advice. If I announce I'm a Chaos Dwarf player I rather like the idea of a store member who would simply ask "oh, nice. How are you fielding them?" and then if I suggested a ludicrously expensive option (like blending normal Dwarfs and Chaos Warriors / Marauders) would try to come up with a cheaper alternative (like Mantic).

Actually, what I would really love is a store manager who told Space Marine players not to buy Land Raiders and to come up with something more original that wasn't so bloody overdone, and who would hide all the Special Character models and pretend to be out of stock. Shame it'll never happen.

[Restayvien]

The thing that really, really puts me off about GW these days is that I feel like I'm being sold to. I really, really hate their banter.

Nail on head. One of the reasons I stopped going to GW stores, was because I always often accosted by some member of staff who wanted to talk in order to get me to buy more things or get involved in games systems I didn't already play (and couldn't afford to start), rather than just to chat. Totally the opposite to back in 1998 when I would go into the GW in Southend and the staff were more causual and friendly rather than pressurising and manic.
Anyway, let's try not to turn this into another GW-bashing thread.

[Mick @ Wargaming247.com]

Hey guys - I'm loving the feedback on this one, so many useful comments here and it's going to be really helpful to creating a store where people like to browse and play - and hey, may even buy something too! I think the friendly atmosphere is very important and that everyone should get a warm welcome whether they're visiting for the first time or come in every week.

We fully intend to branch out and have already been playing Talisman, Gears of War and Dust Tactics form Fantasy Flight Games, as well as Dungeons and Dragons: Castle Ravenloft from Wizards of the Coast in USA. They're all great standalone games with heavy boxes and plenty of stuff inside to paint or just play with straight away.

We also want to sell Magic The Gathering and other card based games as these are great fun to collect and play. I want to run all of these games in the store so you can see how good they are.

So, thanks very much for all of your comments, they are much appreciated and if anyone else has an opinion on the way they like to be treated in a store - and what if any specialist or hard to find games you'd like to see in our store, that would be great.

In reply to Masked Thespian, thanks for your comments and yes we have all the core books on wargaming247.com, they're just listed with each army they go with - if you use the search tool and type in codex, army book or warhammer armies, you'll see the full range there - maybe I should make these more obvious, have a core books section maybe?

In reply to Jonagon, again thanks very much for contributing to this discussion. Yes, despite us selling it at 20% discount, we've barely had any demand and I must confess haven't ordered it in evry single month. This is going to change, we will get back issues and I will put them all on the site, just a simple listing for each one so people can regularly order.

In reply to Restayvien thanks for sticking your neck out and kicking off the discussion with a very comprehensive answer to all my questions, that was great! 

[Restayvien]

Glad to help!

[Thantos]

Great news, seeing as you already have the premisis? Thats making good use of it!

The wargameing community needs more friendly places where you can meet people and get involved in the hobby. Kudos for setting up a store and acting as a beacon for new hobbyists

Just have a place to game and paint, keep up the great prices you guys have, and im sure once the word gets around, you should evolve into a hub of gaming and hobby-ing

... Shame im nowhere near Hertsforshire

[Masked Thespian]

In reply to Masked Thespian, thanks for your comments and yes we have all the core books on wargaming247.com, they're just listed with each army they go with - if you use the search tool and type in codex, army book or warhammer armies, you'll see the full range there - maybe I should make these more obvious, have a core books section maybe?

I think you misunderstand me.  I was looking for the core Warhammer Fantasy Rulebook, but you don't seem to carry it at all.  The closest you do carry is the Island of Blood, but I was after the larger, hardback book.  That said, a central location for all of your books would be a good idea, in my opinion, though if you wanted to have different sections for different game systems then that would also be good.

[Scoutfox]

Good luck in your businees I hope you guys do great. I know it is a tough type of store to run with three stores around me closing in the last few years. There is only one active hobby store in central Massachusetts. I'll help anyway I can to have the hobby do well elsewhere.

•What makes you want to go to a store? Is it based on price? Or a good vibe about the place?
I think atmosphere is the most important, and are other people playing my game. If I do 40k and everyone else plays hordes then I'll probably never come back. The owners of the store I go to are very nice, and you can tell they care about the hobby, and one plays in games all the time and helps run the tournaments.

•what would you like to see going on in the store?

I like to go to tournaments, though not ones with a cuthroat attitude (though you can do ard boyz type ones every now and then), campaigns are always fun but I never have the time, and hobby time like painting/building is a good thing to offer.

•do you like to be emailed weekly and told what's going on or do you get enough of these emails from retailers already and would prefer a more off-hands approach generally?

My store does a monthly newsletter that we subscribe to and that is fine. I'd like a coupon on there too.


•what products would you like to see in a store that you can't buy at a Games Workshop store?

Not sure I don't buy from GW direct, it's either Ebay, Bartertown, or my LGS.


•what lines would you like us to stock?

Again I only play 40k, so as long as each army has enough to field and army available I'd be happy. Specialist games would be nice, they are a great way to get people into warhammer on the cheap and get them hooked on the background.

•how far do you have to travel to the nearest high street shop to buy what you're after?

I drive 30 minutes to get to my LGS, and wouldn't go much further unless you had some kind of mega-game or tournament, but not for regular gaming.

•how far are you prepared to travel and what would it take to encourage you to pop in and see us?

Above.

•In store events - do these encourage you to come in?

Yes

•Should we run a gaming club? Perhaps with extra discount for members?

A good idea, and if my LGS offered the 20% discount you guys do I'd buy more from them. They recently did groupons and sold a ton of merchandise because of it. Without a discount I don't see any strictly hobby store competing with the internet.

•Would you like late night opening during the week? Maybe so you could pop in after work for instance?

That is a good idea since some people can't get away on weekends and have to work. I probably wouldn't even open before noon unless you can get good foot traffic by your store. Gamers on the whole are in school, or work and don't like to wake up early.

[SILKiam]

When It's all done 2S must descend on it in a big orgy of Wargames and Pizza

[Mick @ Wargaming247.com]

SILKiam, that sounds like a great idea! You guys would not want to see the progress shots at the moment, it's a right state in there!

Mantic Journal - Games Workshop do White Dwarf, Mantic Games do the Mantic Journal! It's a good read and normally costs £2.50 a copy. Mantic are launching Warpath in November so we'll be playing that over here. They also produce the great (and recently revised) Kings of War fantasy battle game and Dwarf Kings Hold which is a superb dungeon crawling game in a box, that you can play inside an hour.

[Saulus]

Perhaps a mislocalized question. Now that you folks have a Brick store, does this mean you can sell to us in the Americas, or does the embargo restrict all international sales, online or not?

[Mick @ Wargaming247.com]

Saulus - thanks for your input on this - to clarify as an independent stockist of Games Workshop products we are limited to selling them in the European Economic area only. However we can sell and ship you anything else as Games Workshop are the only company implementing this policy.

DEF Knight - thanks also for your comments. Yes you're right, lighting is important and we're going for more subdued lighting along with natural daylight, so it'll be great for painting and playing.

[Restayvien]

...how about a bar?

[Mick @ Wargaming247.com]

I could really do with a bar at the moment, that's a great idea   

Things have progressed here, thought I'd let you all know.

• We're soon to move into a high street location. We were planning on setting this up in our warehouse but felt it would be much better to get out on the high street despite high rents etc. We're moving imminently to 37 High Street Buntingford Herts and our grand launch day is Saturday 29th October at 12 noon. If you're in the area and would like to come over and have a look, we'd love to see you.
• The high street shop is called LOST ARK GAMES. We have the domain name http://www.LostArkGames.com which will take you our wargaming247.com site. We'll continue with our online store and run the two in conjunction.
• We've taken all the feedback in this thread and tried to produce the most effective shop that meets most of the criteria we've discussed in the thread. It's very tricky because of issues with space, stocking a high street store and getting the right mix of gameplay and modelling areas whilst keeping the essential retail space, but we think we've found the right balance and between now and the 29th we'll be fitting out the shop and getting it all together.
• Looking at our online sales since launch, it's been a tough 6 months and despite starting with a 20% discount (which was completely unsustainable) and then going down to 10%, it's actually done nothing in terms of attracting customers. We've therefore decided to sell the products on the online store and in the shop at full retail price but will allow us to do regular special offers and we'll be relying on you to tell us what products you want them to be on. This is necessary for us to continue. I didn't fully appreciated the costs in establishing and keeping a retail business running and sustainable. I knew I just enjoyed the whole hobby and thought it would be a great area to work in. There are certainly lots of online retailers that we simply cannot compete with as they either are selling to thousands of customers and making very little on each sale, or they've done their maths wrong and are making no money whatsoever.
• The prices are going to change on the website immediately, but we've got a pre-launch deal open to all members of Second Sphere. From now and up to and including our Launch Day on the 29th October, add the code LOSTARK at checkout and get 15% off of any order with us. That's 5% off more than we're offering right now, it's just for you guys and it is a limited deal. We'll offer more exclusive deals to members as we go on, as well as still supplying prizes to all winners of second Sphere's Big Contests.

[Restayvien]

I can understand the need for retail prices, for an independant high-street retailer. Just one question - will you be stocking BFG stuff? That's all I'm really looking to buy in the near future, and the discount would mean I'd buy it from you. ^^

[Mick @ Wargaming247.com]

Hi - Battlefleet Gothic shouldn't be a problem to get. Although I haven't played it (looks fantastic though!) it would appear that we could order on our trade account from GW.

When we're settled in the high street store we want all of the products to be available on the online store, as well as to customers in-store, so whatever you're after, it can be ordered, paid for and then ordered in for you to collect at store or have delivered. As we have more interaction with customers and they ask, as you have, for particular items, we can expand our range further.

[Wargamer]

Be sure to let us know if, perhaps in a fit of madness, you start stocking 6mm stuff - I plan to grab a new Epic army around christmas, and there's no way in hell I'm paying GW prices so I'll be looking for alternative ranges.

[SILKiam]

Im actually quite tempted just to take a trip to the opening day, for a giggle

Fancy a game mick?