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Author Topic: Isengard help needed!  (Read 3631 times)

Offline Zackdanials

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Isengard help needed!
« on: January 15, 2014, 12:26:39 AM »
So I've never played LotR bar one intro game at my local store but I'm feeling Isengard as an army simply because the Uruk-Hai are so cool. However I could do with a bit if assistance...

I'm not sure if the usual size of a LotR game but I have a vague idea it's 600 points? Here's my first ever bash at a list, please feel free to tell me where I've messed up or I'm just being plain daft:

Warband: Uruk-Hai captain w/heavy armour, shield
7x Uruk-Hai w/shield
4x Uruk-Hai w/crossbow
1x Uruk-Hai w/banner

Warband: Uruk-Hai Shaman w/Armour
8x Uruk-Hai w/pikes
4x Uruk-Hai w/crossbows

Warband: Sharku w/Warg, shield
3x Warg Rider w/shield, throwing spears
1x Isengard Troll w/spear

So that comes out at 599 points and 31 models, giving me a breakpoint of sixteen. I figure I have a decent combat centre of Uruk-Hai with shields backed up by pikes/crossbows and a shaman then a troll for anything nasty (I'm looking at you Aragorn...). Plus I have Sharku and his boys for flanking/hero hunting etc.

So I figure maybe I'm a bit thin on the ground? 31 models doesn't seem an awful lot to me and a sixteen model breakpoint is quite disconcerting. I also suspect I should probably drop a few of the pikes for more shields to beef up the first wave, or maybe more crossbows?

The only models I've actually bought so far is the Uruk-Hai boxed set with five pikes and five shields so I'm open to any suggestions you have.

Any advice would be grand.


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Offline Jonagon

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Re: Isengard help needed!
« Reply #1 on: January 15, 2014, 06:37:33 AM »
Right. I'm in a similar boat to yourself in terms of experience. It seems that events in the UK vary pt levels anywhere between 350 and 800 pts.

I don't think you're a million miles away with your numbers. This site seems pretty good if you want to look at some other people's lists and see what events are going on (in terms of points used).

http://www.one-ring.co.uk/index.php


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Offline Mabbz

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Re: Isengard help needed!
« Reply #2 on: January 15, 2014, 08:10:47 AM »
Well, I haven't played in a while and my armies were always tiny dwarf forces, but here's my thoughts:

For the usual size game you'll need to check wherever you plan to play. I seem to recall my local GW using 250 for drop in games, but they also tended to have doubles games, so 500. It will depend entirely on where you play.

As for the list, it looks good to me. Experience has taught me to hate warg riders, especially since wargs don't necessarily run away is their rider is killed. Keep the shaman out of trouble and you wont need to worry about the 16 model break point; fury lasts forever unless he loses a combat or dies, so cast it as early as possible and keep him protected at all times.

Does the troll have any other options? Unless he has some special rules I don't know of, a spear really isn't worth it. Having him support an uruk is a complete waste of his high strength and fight values. If you can, give him a shield.

Offline silverfuge

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Re: Isengard help needed!
« Reply #3 on: January 15, 2014, 08:42:52 AM »
Tbh with Lotr there are arnt any bad lists. Only thing I would consider is the banner.

31 minis is about average tbh. My LGS plays 400 points so I reckon its just what you feel like.

strategy wise things to note.

1. Crossbows cant move and shoot
2. If your wargs are in the winning side of combat and they charged all enemies below S6 go prone so worth considering for all the extra attacks.
3. If you haven't read the new monster rules for the troll and never worry about heroes again.

I don't normally post advice so hoped that helps.
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Offline Zackdanials

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Re: Isengard help needed!
« Reply #4 on: January 15, 2014, 08:43:12 AM »
The Isengard troll comes with heavy armour and a shield, the only upgrade you can give him is a spear and I had a few spare points so I figured what the hell it may come in handy at some point.

So in the BrB it says fury's duration is exhaustion, lasting until the shamans will runs out. Does that mean it drains a point of will a turn to keep the spell active? Or does it keep automatically going, leaving you free to use the will points elsewhere? (Until they run out obviously)


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Offline silverfuge

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Re: Isengard help needed!
« Reply #5 on: January 15, 2014, 08:48:06 AM »
I believe you lose a will a turn.
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Offline Mabbz

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Re: Isengard help needed!
« Reply #6 on: January 15, 2014, 09:44:31 AM »
The Isengard troll comes with heavy armour and a shield, the only upgrade you can give him is a spear and I had a few spare points so I figured what the hell it may come in handy at some point.
Fair enough. I doubt you'll ever use it though.

Quote
So in the BrB it says fury's duration is exhaustion, lasting until the shamans will runs out. Does that mean it drains a point of will a turn to keep the spell active? Or does it keep automatically going, leaving you free to use the will points elsewhere? (Until they run out obviously)
I believe you lose a will a turn.
No spell causes you to lose a point of will per turn as far as I can see in the rulebook. Most ongoing spell automatically end if you run out of will points, but Fury doesn't. Cast it and it'll last until your shaman dies or loses a combat.

Offline Zackdanials

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Re: Isengard help needed!
« Reply #7 on: January 15, 2014, 09:59:18 AM »
Is fury that useful? I don't have the book to hand right now but from what I can remember reading it didn't strike me as that great, however a lot of people say it's worth it.

As to the trolls spear it'll disappear as soon as I spot something to replace it with, I could get another crossbow for example at the cost of a shield/pike Uruk.


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Offline Mabbz

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Re: Isengard help needed!
« Reply #8 on: January 15, 2014, 10:31:05 AM »
Well, Fury gives every model within 6" a 6+ save against any wound suffered, as well as letting your models auto pass any courage test they may have to take. So, yeah it's pretty good. A 6+ save is better than nothing after all, and if he survives then you won't need to worry about your 16 model breakpoint.

I wouldn't take another crossbow if I were you. You want decent numbers in combat more than you want one more ranged attack.

Offline silverfuge

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Re: Isengard help needed!
« Reply #9 on: January 15, 2014, 05:08:37 PM »
Having read Hobbit rule book just says requires all will and ends when you have zero will. So seems if you cast it it stays on.

I personally say don't buy more crossbowmen as a shield would be better as combat better than ranger shooting.
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Offline Zackdanials

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Re: Isengard help needed!
« Reply #10 on: January 16, 2014, 10:45:50 AM »
Thanks for the comments guys. So is the list workable as it is? I was thinking of squeezing in a few berserkers with their high defence to bulk up the shield uruks a bit more. Plus I think the models are very cool...

Also should I divide the shield/pike uruks between war bands? As it is the pikes are in one and the shields in a different one, and with the chance of being deployed quite close to the enemy I'm thinking maybe mixed war bands of shields/pikes/crossbows would be best?


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Offline silverfuge

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Re: Isengard help needed!
« Reply #11 on: January 16, 2014, 04:02:38 PM »
It makes very little difference as you can deploy how you like as each mini individual you only buy them in warbands. Not too sure on berserkers until i can check the relevant book.

Had a look the two handed weapons are good as they make it easier to kill things just ensure their in a multi combat to negate their minus 1 to combat rolls.
« Last Edit: January 16, 2014, 04:08:28 PM by silverfuge »
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Offline Zackdanials

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Re: Isengard help needed!
« Reply #12 on: January 16, 2014, 06:16:38 PM »
Apologies masked thespian, I'll keep that in mind in future.

Thanks for the advice on two handed weapons silverfuge, definitely gonna stick some in somewhere now. When I read the rules it didn't occur to me to simply back them up with other warriors to even the odds, but as I said I'm new to this!

As to deployment the rulebook states no model can be deployed further than 6" from its warband captain and there's a fifty-fifty chance the warband has to deploy within 12" of the centre of the board (these are the deployment rules from most of the standard game scenarios in the hobbit rulebook, not the scenarios relating to the films) This makes me suspect mixed warbands would be better just in case they find themselves closer to the enemy than they want to be. Two bad priority roles later and you'd have Wargs/riders of Rohan/galadrian knights in your face. 


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Offline Mabbz

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Re: Isengard help needed!
« Reply #13 on: January 16, 2014, 09:16:09 PM »
Berserkers are pretty good if you support them like Silverfuge said. As I recall they also have a good Courage stat, so you can count on them to stick around even if you break and lose your shaman. They also have two attacks, all for just a few points more than a regular warrior. Definitely worth it.

I haven't see The Hobbit rulebook, but if those are the rules then yes, I'd say you should mix the shields and pikes together for exactly the reasons you said.

Offline Zackdanials

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Re: Isengard help needed!
« Reply #14 on: January 17, 2014, 12:25:57 AM »
Aye in the hobbit book four of the six 'standard' scenarios use this deployment. You roll a dice for each warband and set up either no more than 12" from the centre or anywhere your side of the table no closer than 12" to the centre. Makes deployment a bit random and kinda dissuades you from taking warbands only made up of archers etc.

So I'm convinced about the berserkers, they seem a solid investment. Any other suggestions? Especially where a leader is concerned, an Uruk captain with shield is hard as nails and not too expensive but lacks a certain something.



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