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The latest power build, how to deal with it?

Started by Arguleon-veq, December 01, 2012, 04:11:02 AM

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Arguleon-veq

From the latest tournament results it seems that this kind of build is starting to dominate:

Destroyer Lord [1 or 2],
3x5 Wraiths,
3 Anhi Barges,
3-4 Night Scythes,
3-4 units of Warriors led by Voltaic Staff Crypteks.

It has great mobility, anti air, firepower, combat power and its all pretty durable. Those Night Scythes put those Warriors exactly where they need to be and when they need to be there.

So how do we deal with this with other armies?
X-Wing Tournaments;
1st - 38
11th - 33

BigToof

Interestingly enough, mass flamers and screamers could deal with this, especially as both are pretty resilient.  They could potentially get pretty close to wiping more than a few squads before they can do too much and flamers would also do a great deal of harm on overwatch.

Orks might have a more of a hard time if you can't really get tarpits going as the Wraiths and Barges are quite tough.

Dark Eldar might have a bit of a hard time unless they can get Dark Lances going.  Still tough going.

Foot guard would get killed.

Hmm... tough cookie to deal with indeed...

Best,
-BT
BigToof Points:

Cammerz: 8
Waaaghpower: 1
The Man They Call Jayne: 3
Mabbz: 6
Archon Sharrek: 3

Arguleon-veq

I think Flamer/Screamer spam is definately up there in terms of power but even they struggle with this build as Kairos gets shot down pretty easily by all the Tesla and Flamers lose their lovely ignore saves rule thanks to the wraiths invun save. The same for screamers, I think wraiths beat them due to durability. Then the Daemons struggle with all the flyers.

Ive tried footguard against it twice so far, the first I just lost out in a game I was unlucky not to win and the second I just got mauled.
X-Wing Tournaments;
1st - 38
11th - 33

Lord Sotek

I find myself wondering how a Chaos force that spammed Hades Cannon forgefiends might do?

Forgefiends are appreciably durable, the S8 will let them get through quantum shielding, and while they don't have Skyfire, sheer number of shots combined with their reroll ability could perhaps give the edge needed to down the Night Scythes. From there, they can be used to down Barges, and have both strength and weight of fire enough to pose a real threat to anything left in that list.

The question I guess is whether that works on the tabletop rather than just in my head; whether you can keep your Fiends alive for long enough; and what other units would be the best choice to weather the 'Crons, fill out the rest of the roster, and support the Forge Fiend Flak Fusillade.
Quote from: Saulus on March 17, 2011, 06:16:56 PM
Often I hear delusional ramble like "I painted and collected my army as ultramarine tyranid hunters....but Pedro is really good, so now I'm using him, but I'm just going to call him Jimbob-Fistpumper, cause that fits with my

Chicop76

#4
Lokking at the list i would say heavy anti-tank and anti-air options should help against thist list. Aginst my Daemon list it will be bother some since +3 invulernable saves and 13 armour with 3 flyers would be hard to deal with.

With guard I would say 3 Vendettas with some Hydra tanks with mass fire power should do well against that list. With Tau and Eldar the Wraiths can pose a problem and shread your army to bits.

I think if you can add modifers to slow the flyers advance like them coming on 4s the second turn should help. Their is anti horde and anti marine elements in the list.

If playing a horde list your best bet is to pop the barges as soon as possible which it will be easy to overwhelm the troops inside. The wraiths shouldn't be a problem with large hordes the problem is dealing with the flyers. I would ignore the flyers and focus on the scoring units. With a list like that you can possibly get first blood easier than they can. Killing the Warlord is going to be tough and line breaker with that force shouldn't be that hard to do unless you static, although that list can get the line breaker points rather easy. Get first blood and contest as possible and try to squeese out a win by causing denial and winning by the first blood vp.

I have to look up to see if Wraiths have power weapons or not. I am so use to playing Daemons and using Fateweaver to tie them up I forget if they have power weapons or not. Also the Daemon list I run nowadays only have invulnerable saves so I forget if they have invulnerable saves or not. I would dare say a squad of Orc flamers and a squad of 5 or more Flamers of tzeentch can really hurt and assaulting squad of Wraiths. Any other squad like 3 man flame guard vets don't really put enough wounds on the assaulting Wraiths to really make a huge differance.

My best course of action is to focus on the barges with warriors and use tie up units against the wraiths and simply igore the flyers.

I would say which armies you looking to counter this list with. Tau and Eldar in my opinion would have the toughest time against this list due to flying wraiths. Blood Angels and Daemon Hunters have flyers, melee, and shooting which they shouldn't have a hard time against that list. Orcs and Dark Eldar should be able to counter that list due to flyers and mass bodies. Chaos Marines have 5 possible flying units which can do well and Daemons if the get a good first turn deep strike should be able to do well against said list as well. Tyranids I think would have a hard time against that list and Sisters as well due to mid range fire and lack of any real anti air.

I looked over the necron book and realised that the wraiths can't enter transports and have rending. The best way to deal with them is to pepper them with mass fire power to force saves. They can move rather fast, so you can't really igore them. I would say depending on what you play and what are the objecties it is best to reduce them down to 2 which means they will do less in combat.

I still think it would be best to focus on the transports and troops. I would ignore the flyers since they only a real threat to light vehicles and to some troops.