Taking on New Tau, what will work?

[Arguleon-veq]

Well the new Tau have had a week to settle down now and the serious power builds seem to be settling along these lines;

2 or 3 units of Missile Broadsides - 3xBroadsides with HYMP's, SMS + 6 Missile Drones, some people take Skyfire, some dont.
2 or 3 Riptides with Ion then its usually either Skyfire+Intercept or FnP and Skyfire.
Kroot to score [usually 4+ units of 10 with a Hound in each].
Commanders with Marker Drones or lots of Pathfinders.

A list like that is totally brutal in the shooting phase and guns down around 20 Marines in a single turn. Youd think the scoring is fragile but its not too bad as it stays in reserve and then outflanks into cover. By the time they come on most of the opposing army will be crippled.

Ive been looking at my current lists and honestly, they will not cut it against that kind of build. Id be lucky to ever see turn 4. The problem is that even if you go first , it is really hard to atually hurt the Tau army, the Broadsides and Riptides all have 2+ saves, good toughness and multiple wounds.

Here are a few options/builds that I think could work;

1. Wolves in Wagons

This is very much an eggs in one basket job but it actually performs pretty well against some other powerful builds.

Logan Grimnar
3or4x4 Wolf Guard Terminators with Axes
3or4 Land Raiders with Multi Meltas [1 as a dedicated transport if they can take one]

Tau will have an absoloute nightmare when it comes to dealing with the land raiders and even if the Riptides take a Fusion Blaster your Termie actually outrange the Melta with a charge. Their effective melta range is 15'' whereas your average charge should be 19''.

The Lascannons and Multi Meltas on the Land Raiders can actually kill the Riptides and Broadsides whilst the Heavy Bolters are good for killing Drones and the Termie will butcher those small Kroot units.

All those Land Raiders and 2+ saves also come in really handy against Necron Tesla and against Helldrakes.

[BigToof]

Agreed that AV14 is going to be your new best friend.

Tau had a hard time with them in the past, even with S10 railguns, but now it's even harder as many people are pumping out too many missiles and not enough fusion in the current meta.

I'd at least make sure to keep Terminator clad Wolf Guard in your Grey Hunters too, but BE CAREFUL of wandering AP2 that ignores cover...

I...  I think I might run my Battlewagons again!

Best,
-BT

[Arguleon-veq]

2. Guard Psyker Barrage

3 Battle Psyker Squads.
6-8 10 man Guard Units with an Autocannon in each.
2 Platoon Commands with Autocannon in each.
2 Spec Wep Teams with Flamers [to keep them cheap].
Primaris.
2 Vendettas with HB's [Spec Wep teams in here]
A Squad of 2 Leman Russ with hull Lascannons.
0-1 Manticore.
1 or 2 Medusa [S10 AP2 Barrage].

What this list has going for it against Tau are that firstly it outranges them. If your going second you can simply sit outside of the broadside range, you will have to take the Riptide shooting for a turn but thats not too bad.

You can hide both of your barrage tanks behind the Russ' to keep them safe. Then first turn you can walk your psykers forward and lower the Ld of every Broadside unit to 2. Then you can pound away at their units with your barrage, battlecannons, autocannons[for drones]. All you have to do is kill 3 models from each and then each unit will be running, quite possibly straight off the table. If a squads survives its not too bad as you have lots of different scoring units. The Vendettas will help to bring down those Riptides whilst the Flamer Teams can help kill Kroot late game.

I think this list will actually do pretty well against other lists too. All those S8+ Large Blasts will be great against Wraiths. 

[BigToof]

Agree on #2.

Mech Guard still don't have THAT much to fear as they have much cheaper vehicles, and Tau really can't kill multiple tanks as easily anymore.

It's clearly a quantity versus quality sort of thing, and sadly enough, I think the Guard have it still.

The list does hinge on the use of Psyker squads, which always makes me worry a bit, but I think you have a good chance of dealing with them better than most.

Best,
-BT

[Arguleon-veq]

3. Stay Out of Range!

For anybody using a shooty army, these new Tau builds are at their best inside 30'' as that is when those broadsides really start to put out a lot of shots. Riptides I actually dont think put out much pain if you use cover and spread out properly.

So I actually think if you are running a firepower heavy army that works at 48'' that you are best letting the Tau go first and then setting up outside of 36'' of those broadsides, it will take them 2 turns to get them into range on you then, by which point you will have hopefully done some damage.

[KCKitsune]

the high yield missile pod seems like a nice idea, but I will ALWAYS run with my broadsides carrying heavy rail rifles.  Sorry, my death rain and Fire knives carry all the missile pods that I need. 

[The Man They Call Jayne]

Combine the 2. 3 Railrifles + 6 Missile Drones.

[Alcibiates]

Combine the 2. 3 Railrifles + 6 Missile Drones.

There is always the option to take three railrifles with target locks and six missile drones. Declare your original attack with all nine, target lock off the broadsides to wherever they need to go. Protection for your broadsides via the missile drones dying off, extra twelve shots via the missile drones, and your railrifles can split fire as needed

[KCKitsune]

Doesn't work because the broadsides are going to be catching lascannon fire.  You need the shield drones to keep your squad alive.

[Alcibiates]

Doesn't work because the broadsides are going to be catching lascannon fire.  You need the shield drones to keep your squad alive.

Put the missile drones up front. I'll trade las cannons for missile drones for the first few turns. I've been playing with alternating drones and suits for optimal protection.

[Osiris]

i dunno, i say deepstrike those termies and land raiders. toss in a couple droppods with sternguard or other heavy hitting unit and take those damn suits out. but that is just my opinion. no telling if it would work though.

[Chicop76]

i already faced deepstriking termies and will tell you it's a very bad ideal thanks to interceptor and rapid fire plus army wide over watch.

Don't know how landraiders will do, but if like say a lot of suits have interceptor than deep strking is a bad ideal.

[Scalphunta]

Greetings,

You can hurt Tau by committing to the drop pod assault. The overwatch and supporting fire will obliterate 1 or 2 drop pods, but what about 9? First turn involves 3 full squads of Stern Guard, 2 Iron clad dreds @ HS due to Master of Forge. Second turn involves the other drop pods and any mobile units to get into range. Nothing says good morning like Ultramarines being shoved down one's throat. Force your opponent to make choices instead of sitting back picking army apart.

[The Man They Call Jayne]

For you to get 9 Drop Pods in your game would have to be VAST as you cannot place more than half your army in reserve now.

In addition, as you cannot assault the turn you arrive from reserve you are at the mercy of Tau Rapid fire, which, if an Ethereal is nearby, means 3 Pulse shots from every rifle within 15" and every carbine within 9". With Markers, there isn't much that will survive the sheer weight of numbers.

[Chicop76]

For you to get 9 Drop Pods in your game would have to be VAST as you cannot place more than half your army in reserve now.

In addition, as you cannot assault the turn you arrive from reserve you are at the mercy of Tau Rapid fire, which, if an Ethereal is nearby, means 3 Pulse shots from every rifle within 15" and every carbine within 9". With Markers, there isn't much that will survive the sheer weight of numbers.

Beat me to it.

Now if you either ds your whole army as da turn 1 violating half the rules, but people in your local area are too dumb to ctually read them than yes that would be a problem. Also the newest violation is black templar deepstriking staying in drop pods.


That being said if you shoot the pods and not the guys that come out you will lose. You can potentially do more damage to yourself than what x army is doing to you.

Thinking about it however. Such a force can seriously hurt your tanks.

Although if you are playing 6th you only can deepstrike 1/2 your army. If such an army go first they might do some damage.

Even so I faced this in the past and still won with Tau, barely. The problem I had was stuff blocking line of sight and giving out cover saves all over the place.

I think a guard/ DA army with ranged fire with 1st turn deep strike going turn 1 can possibly beat the new Tau.