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Messages - Arguleon-veq

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This was to be our second tournament after a great showing from our guys at our first [1st,2nd,5th,13th out of 36].

We went into this event putting a little more pressure on ourselves thanks to the results we managed at our first event and for me obviously anything less than first would be a backwards step!. I did make a few minor changes to my list though after some pretty heavy losses in some warm-up games to a rebel swarm consisting of 3 X-Wings and 2 Y-Wings.

Here is what I would be taking -

Obsidian TIE;
Obsidian TIE;
Obsidian TIE
Krassis; Heavy Laser Cannon

So I had dropped the Recon Specialist on Krassis for extra pilot skill on my regular TIE's. I figured that with the amount of low pilot skill rebel ships around [3B2A etc] that I would be better served with that than the extra durability that the Recon Spec usually provides Krassis. Of course it would be a total waste of points if coming up against a whole list at PS4 or above, so I really didn't want to be facing Bloody Daggers. Some of the guys stuck with their lists, some mixed it up, here is what we took.

Dan -

Rookie X;
Rookie X;
Dagger B
; Fire Control System, Heavy Laser Cannon

So Dan was sticking with his 'Plan B' list.

Ste -

Storm Advanced; Cluster Missiles
Storm Advanced; Cluster Missiles
Captain Jonus; Assault Missiles, Seismic Charge

Ste had really gone for a change, this list had actually done really well for him in practice games though, beating my Blue Thunder rebels [which I had never lost with] and pushing my usual list very close.

Adam -

Chewwy; Draw Their Fire
Rookie X;
Proto A;
Gold Y

Adam was struggling to settle on a list and so decided to go for the reliable Falcon and a bit of everything else.

Simo -

Obsidian TIE;
Obsidian TIE;
Obsidian TIE;
Obsidian TIE;
Advanced Sensors, Engine Upgrade

Simo had done pretty well in his practice games with this list, it had only really struggled with my list thanks to Krassis usually taking out Howlrunner early on him.

::Game 1::

Dagger B; Fire Control, Heavy Laser
Dagger B; Fire Control, Heavy Laser
Proto A;
Proto A

I was pretty worried about this squad as it had the potential to take out Howlrunner really early with those B's and I figured I would struggle to get a good bead on those A's late game.

Luckily for me, my opponent split his force into A's and B's and had the A's facing off against my entire squad at the start of the game. Thanks to this I killed an A in the first engagement before the B's could swoop into range on the flank. I then let his second A get away in order to hard turn into those B's which killed one for the loss of an Obsidian. In the next turn we K turned and faced off again which seen me take down his second B for a bit of damage on Howly and after that it was just a case of chasing his last A down and finishing it off.

::Game 2::

Bounty Hunter; Proximity Mine
Lambda[PS2]; Heavy Laser
Academy TIE;
Academy TIE;
Academy TIE;

I wasn't too worried about facing this list, there was a lot in it but nothing that really scared me.

He deployed spread out right across his own board edge which would let me isolate pretty much whatever I wanted and gang up on it before he could bring his whole squad to bear on me. Things started off pretty terribly though when the Bounty Hunter at long range [with no focus as it evaded] killed Howly despite her focus, 3 hits, 4 blanks. Despite this I still put quite a lot of damage into his Shuttle.

I took out his shuttle next turn and then started working on his TIE's as his Bounty Hunter was still slowly trying to get into the fight fully thanks to being deployed quite wide. I started killing off his TIEs but lost another of my own and Krassis had taken a bit of damage.

Once I engaged his Bounty Hunter I lost a full, undamaged TIE to his Proximity Mine which was pretty frustrating. By this point though the time was running down and I was pretty sure I wouldn't have time to kill off his Bounty Hunter which was all he had left. So with this in mind I just kept Krassis and my last TIE out of range for a few turns.

Coming into the last turn Krassis still had 2 hull and my opponent managed to just squeeze into range of him with his Bounty Hunter but this was range 3, through an asteroid and I had a focus. He gets 3 hits, I get 4 blanks again, killing Krassis and the game ends in a full win for him as I only have 1 Obsidian TIE left.

A frustrating loss but I had to laugh about it. That Bounty Hunter of his was definitely man of the match!.

::Game 3::

Red X;
Red X;
Dagger B
; Adv Sensors
Dagger B; Adv Sensors

This was exactly the list I didn't want to face but it would be an interesting challenge.

We started out very slowly dancing around on opposite sides of the asteroids before we engaged, Krassis did very poorly over the first few turns and just wasn't getting any hits. He was taking some fairly heavy fire in return and his first hull damage was a critical that lost him that Heavy Laser re-roll.

Once we got in tight and ended up with a bit of a crash in the middle of the table it was always going to be an uphill battle for me against those Sensors, the B's having actions in amongst these crashes proved pretty decisive and my TIE's fell away pretty quickly.

Krassis still wasn't putting out enough damage but I had taken down a B and an X and had his other B down to one hull, but his final X had only lost its shields. Krassis was down to a couple of hull against his final two ships and although I just couldn't get the hits to finish his ships off, Krassis did lead a charmed life on the defence for a few turns getting double evade after double evade, even getting a triple evade at one point. In the end though Krassis didn't manage to do any more damage at all and his hot evade dice finally ran out, giving me my second loss of the day.

::Game 4::

Han Solo; Gunner, Marksmanship
Gold Y; Ion Cannon Turret
Gold Y; Ion Cannon Turret

A pretty solid list but Falcons aren't really something that tends to trouble my list too much so I thought I had a good chance in this one.

As it turns out my dice were very lucky this game. In the first engagement I took Han down to 1 hull and I had also managed to get a critical through on him that meant he wouldn't be shooting next turn. Han did kill a TIE in that first exchange though and he managed to Ion Krassis. After my crazy dice in that initial engagement though there wasn't too much my opponent could do, I finished off Han next turn and then it was a case of slowly hunting down the Y's with my squad although he did manage to bring Howly down in the end too.

::Game 5::

I was drawn against Simo for my final game and as we both stood on 2 wins, a win for either of us would give us a decent shot at making the top 8 cut. I was pretty confident though as our lists had faced each other 4 or 5 times and I'd won them all thanks to Krassis' extra firepower being able to take out his Howly early.

Obsidian TIE;
Obsidian TIE;
Obsidian TIE;
Obsidian TIE;
Advanced Sensors, Engine Upgrade

Simo deployed his Shuttle out on a flank and got a really nice block in with it on a couple of TIEs and Krassis for our first engagement. This should have given him the action advantage in our initial shoot off but he decided to barrel roll to try and get out of some of my arcs. He did get out of a few but it left 2 of his TIEs still in arc of everything so I just focused my fire on those and was taking less damage in return thanks to him losing some focus for his barrel rolls.

Again my dice were pretty good here and his were pretty poor and I come off much better in this firefight. Krassis as usual did enough damage on Howly to allow my Obsidians to finish her off. After this it was a lot of dogfighting but with him losing his ship advantage and his Howly re roll it was pretty one sided as I could ignore his Shuttle for a few turns once it had done its early blocking action. By the time it was back in the fight I was just about finished with his TIEs and could just stay on its tail to finish it off.


Ste hadn't done too well and only managed a single win, and Simo's two wins wouldn't be enough to see him make the top 8 cut. Me and Adam both sat on 3 wins each and Dan was in the lead going into the cut with 5 wins out of 5.

In the end me and Adam both missed out on the cut. I finished 11th, Adam finished 12th, we had missed out on strength of schedule.

Dan would go into the cut though and cruised through his round of 8 with a big win against a triple Interceptor list. In the semi final he come up against;

Wedge; Swarm
Blue B;
Blue B;

Some nice early moves from Dans opponent gave him a commanding lead which Dan struggled to come back from and so Dan finished 3rd/4th in the end.

All in all though our results weren't too bad as a group, although that was certainly helped by Dan's good finish!. So in the end we finished;

Dan - 3rd/4th
Me - 11th
Adam - 12th
Simo - 16th
Ste - 24th

Non-GW Games / Re: Chaos in the Old World [Boardgame Review]
« on: June 10, 2014, 08:25:12 PM »
Fantasy Flight do quite a few Warhammer/40K based games, Ive not tried these but ive heard very good things about ;

Warhammer Diskwars - Which is essentially a full on strategy game like Fantasy but you use Disks instead of units, it sounds stupid but from what ive seen and heard its meant to be a nice game and its infinitely cheaper and easier to store than playing regular fantasy, a £20 expansion gets you a massive army selection for say Undead and then loads of other units for the armies you get in the box. Diskwars

Relic - A 40K boardgame with a lot of RPG elements to it where you are each a character trying to close a chaos gate.

Chaos Marauders - A card based game where you each control an army of Orcs. Marauders

Theres even a couple of collectable/living card games, which id imagine are pretty ideal if your gaming group is quite small;

Warhammer Invasion - Invasion The Card Game

Warhammer 40,000 Conquest - 40,000: Conquest

Non-GW Games / Re: Chaos in the Old World [Boardgame Review]
« on: June 09, 2014, 07:20:54 PM »
Yeah you really should dude, I was very sceptical about board games for years but things like this and most high end modern board games are completely different to any 'classical' board games that they don't feel like a board game at all. No sitting around and not being able to have any effect in another players turn, plenty of alliances and threats and backstabbing, ive been really impressed.

Non-GW Games / Re: Chaos in the Old World [Boardgame Review]
« on: June 08, 2014, 11:24:08 PM »
I totally love shutupandsitdown, possibly the best review show ever!, we are planning on getting both of those games, they look like a real laugh!

Non-GW Games / Chaos in the Old World [Boardgame Review]
« on: June 08, 2014, 12:59:38 AM »
Recently I have started to play a lot of different board games. For a long time I really wasn't keen on the idea as I had always been a miniature gamer and casual card game player. What first got me into it was the Gears of War board game and even that was only because I really wanted the models you got with it!

What really pushed me over the edge was a growing disillusionment with Warhammer/Warhammer 40,000 thanks to some [in my opinion] crazy decisions on GW's part in so many aspects of the hobby, from the glut of downloadable expansions to D-Weapons in regular games and even with the fact that you can now only buy White Dwarf at GW stores.

In order to maintain my miniature gaming fix I resorted to playing Star Wars X-Wing by Fantasy Flight Games. This was a pretty straightforward call for me and our gaming group as we had tried and enjoyed the Gears of War board game which was also by FF[Fantasy Flight]. We are all into Star Wars and importantly for us, the fact that the models come pre made and painted! as nobody in our group really enjoyed that aspect of the hobby [it was just something we endured in order to be able to play at tournaments].

With us all falling for this game so quickly and the fact it was FF's second game we had tried and really enjoyed we decided to try a few more. We got hold of a truly epic game called Twilight Imperium [which can take 12 hours to play!] and all loved that too.

I was starting to miss Warhammer a little though, not so much the game but all that rich background and the fact that we had invested all those years into the game made it really hard to totally cast off. So when I discovered another FF board game called Chaos in the Old World I thought it would be a great way to stay at least partially invested in Warhammer but without having to put up with so many rules that I don't agree with, but of course it would come down to how good this board game actually is.

This is a game where you and your mates literally get to be Chaos Gods, summoning cultists, daemons and even greater daemons across the oldworld in order to conquer and corrupt it.

Chaos in the Old World

The first thing you notice about this game and with all Fantasy Flight products for that matter is the quality. The box, artwork and card quality are all to a very high standard, much higher than you find in many board games.

I personally really like the playing pieces, things like banners on them can be a little bendy but that means that they are never going to break on you.

Some painted minis from the game.

The thing I like most is the map/board itself, although one small complaint is that it can be sometimes hard to tell where the borders are for some of the different regions at a glance.

The dice are nice and once you have popped all of the tokens out and put them in those little plastic bags which you NEED if you are a board game player [or a drug dealer I would imagine!] you can get started on the rules.


Im not going to go too deep into what the actual rules are as that kind of thing never really comes across well and its much better to learn as you play yourself. I found 1 read through of the rules enough to get a good feel for the game and was confident enough with that 1 read to try the game out with friends. It should only take you 10-20 minutes to read the rules and even if they don't become totally clear at first, you will know exactly how everything should work within a couple of turns of your first game, which is also a nice endorsement for a game.

The game only works with 3 or 4 players [5 with the Skaven expansion which we will be picking up soon].

The aim of the game is to conquer regions with your models but also to start to corrupt them with your cultists until they are totally ruined. Both of these things net you victory points and you need 50 to win. Each god also has a threat dial and each god has its own specific way of advancing this threat dial, a second way to win the game is to advance your dial all the way to its victory setting. I was pretty sceptical at first about these two different victory conditions being balanced with each other.


*You each start by picking a god, once you pick a god you will receive a playsheet with lots of handy references on, your models, a deck of magic cards and some upgrade cards.

*You then take some of the tokens from the box [these include things like peasants, nobles, warpstone etc] and these get randomly placed in each region of the map, all the way from Norsca to the Badlands.

*You make a deck of 'Old World' cards.

*Then your ready to start the game!

Game Play:

Each turn starts with an Old World card being drawn and played, and these can very often spell doom for your followers as they can range from things such as a holy crusade in which loads of hero tokens pop up around the board killing your models to the rather pleasant cards where hordes of peasants show up across the map for your daemons to kill and feast on [and if the right cards show up, for you to gain points from!]

Each Chaos god has energy/mana that they can use each turn, this is used to place/summon models, to move them or to cast magic cards. You can only place 1 model/cast 1 spell before your opponent gets to do the same, this sequence goes around the table until nobody has enough energy left to cast anything else.

Your initial followers can be placed anywhere but once you have a model on the map, subsequent models must be placed in adjacent territories. In each territory 2 magic cards[but only 2!] can be placed each turn and these cards will often be the way in which you win the game or at the very least ruin your opponents day!.

If you end up with followers of two different gods in the same area when the battle phase comes around they fight. You fight simply by rolling dice equal to the attack value on your models. Each model also has a defence value, if you equal their defence value you with your hits [you hit on a 4+, with 6's giving you an extra roll] you kill the model.

Once you have ran out of energy and done all your fighting you get to the most important phase. This is where you work out which regions you have dominated and how much you have corrupted each region.

Domination is quite simple, each region has a resistance value [For example, Tilea has 2], you need to beat this score with your conquest value to claim victory points for it [equal to its resistance value, so in this case 2]. Your conquest value is simply the number of models you have left in the region at the end of the turn+the energy cost of any spells you played in the region this turn.

The more interesting part is corruption. At the end of every turn, you place a number of corruption counters in a region equal to the number of cultists you have there. This does nothing initially but when a region hits 12 corruption counters it is ruined and this is where you get big victory point rewards based on who has the most corruption in the region when it is ruined.

Whilst you are battling out for victory points you are also trying to advance those threat dials. Each god has its own way of doing this;

Khorne - By killing models in different regions
Tzeentch - By putting 2 corruption counters in a region with 2 magic or warpstone counters in it
Slaanesh - By putting 2 corruption counters in a region that contains a hero or noble
Nurgle - By putting 2 corruption into a 'populous' region [Kislev, Empire, Brettonia, Estalia]

Every time you manage one of those above criteria you put a counter on your threat dial, at the end of the turn anybody with a counter on theirs moves their dial up by 1, the player with the most counters moves theirs up by 2. Each move on the dial gives you a reward and when you get it all the way around you have won the game.

The other 2 ways for the game to end besides 50 victory points and threat dials are if you run out of Old World cards or if 5 regions are ruined. If either of these happen, the winner is the player with the most victory points.

So how is it to actually play?

Honestly, its one of the best games I have ever played. As I said, I was sceptical about the two different win conditions and the balance of the 4 gods but it is one of the tightest and most balanced systems I have ever played. As an example, here are how our first two games finished;

Game 1 - Khorne, Slaanesh and Tzeentch all within 2 advancements of winning the game by threat dials [so attainable in 1 turn] and Slaanesh and Tzeentch both within touching distance of winning by victory points.  It comes to the last turn [ran out of Old World cards] and Khorne just sneaks it with a threat dial win, Tzeentch and Slaanesh are both within 5 points of 50 victory points and both 1 dial advancement away from a dial win!

Game 2 - Early finish thanks to 5 really quick ruined regions with Nurgle getting the win by victory points but even though it was an early finish Slaanesh was 1 dial advancement away from the win and could have won by victory points next turn and Tzeentch could have also won by victory points next turn!

Not only is this game brilliantly balanced but each god 'feels' right. The magic cards, advancement criteria and daemon stats all work perfectly for how each of these gods should be played. Slaanesh has you manipulating heros with your magic to get them to kill enemy models, Nurgle has you throwing down loads of corruption with a horde of cultists and plaguebearers, Khorne makes you play in a hyper aggressive way thanks to his advancement criteria and lack of cultists so you are constantly going around and killing things for your dial rather than bothering to corrupt whilst Tzeentch gets extra magic cards and is constantly ruining your plans with a well timed card play.

Its a game that will have you in fits of laughter between cursing your opponents for ruining your plans, it never gets boring and your always interested in what everybody else is doing as it will ALWAYS have such a big effect on you. You will be running around trying to kill an opponents last cultist in a region to stop him ruining it before you can get your own counters in there, you will be playing magic cards that stop their troops conquering a region for a turn to deny them those all important victory points. You will be legging it away from Khornes bloodletters to stop him getting ANOTHER advancement counter on his dial.

That last thing that is really refreshing about this game is that it doesn't go on too long, games usually take between 1 and 2 hours which is just about perfect in my opinion.

So all in all a pretty great game, highly recommended!


I played them a bit during 5th, I didn't quite Leafblower them although I had to play against the tournament leafblower llist every week because a mate of ours ran it as his main army. I tried to mix things up a little, usually with some Basilisks and Demols. Still tank heavy though as this was 5th after all :P

I even tried to run combat guard in 5th a few times, so way before it got popular in 6th. Me and a mate even had a few reverse role games, combat guard vs shooty orks! [again 5th, before all top ork armies were shooty!].

I used them once in a 5th Ed Tourney, getting first place at a Doubles event, allied with my mates Grey Knights. Our list was pretty horrendous though, more Vendettas, Chimeras, Psybacks and Psyrifle Dreads than you could shake a stick at :P


In 6th I had them as allies for my Wolves, they did fairly well at a few tournaments and then I started to use a blob but by the time I did the game had passed them by really. They performed very well in my local group though and it did mean I finally got a lot of models painted.

I think that second list is pretty nice.

On those models you want to use, I think your original idea for the models works anyway to be honest, I think those guns in their hands look way more like powerful one shot weapons energy weapons [I imagine them shooting kind of like Ironman does] than a rapid firing weapon like a heavy bolter.

Id put the bigger, close combat Scout Squad in one of the Ravens [drop the Camo for an Axe or other good close combat wep on the Sarg] then your Captain will have a nice unit to join. It will get them into combat safely and it wont be a big loss that your Raven will be dropping down from fly mode because you will still have two flyers zooming about to keep air superiority.

I think that list should work well against pretty much anything you will see.

Im not sure you really need the ultramarine detachment. All your really getting out of it is Tellion, who isn't worth that kind of investment in points to unlock him. If its a fluff thing just have a kitted out sarg for the unit.

On those Centurions I would deffo have Twin Linked Las/Missile on them to give you some real armour/2+ save busting.

It may cost you the Sternguard to be able to fit it in but I think its worth it as I don't think those Sternguard fill a solid role anyway.

I like the idea of losing those and putting those points towards a small unit of las/missile Cents for back field and them a small unit of Grav Cents to drop out of the Raven to tear up big monsters.

Non-GW Games / Re: Magic: The Gathering
« on: March 16, 2014, 07:42:12 PM »
Another good thing about the game is that there are groups almost everywhere, any gaming shops usually have a place to play it or to do Friday Night Magic events. The ones that don't usually organise them to be held at local pubs.

I like the theme but as you've said it will be hard to get the best out of it. Im not really sure the Dark Reapers do enough for the amount of points they are costing. Id consider a Shadow Weaver as I think something that causes pinning like that and is literally raining death from the skies in a pretty horrific way really fits the theme, its also much harder to kill and fulfils multiple roles in terms of what its effective against.

Non-GW Games / Re: Magic: The Gathering
« on: March 14, 2014, 11:56:22 PM »
Well Rhox is worth about £2 so your already up in terms of what you paid :P

Id keep them if your interested in the game. I played about 12 years ago but finally picked it up again a year or two back and whilst I play fairly competitive decks I don't want to put the money in required to really place at proper pro tour qualifiers, I have still managed placings at Friday Night Magic events [which usually have 30-50 players, its like a one night tournament every Friday] and won boosters from it.

Theres a group of us who play and although 2 of the guys put a lot of money into the game the rest of us just play casual and pickup a booster here and there, there are lots of different formats to suit however you want to play. Standard is hard to keep up with as it has to be current cards.

Me and a few of the group have started to play a friendly format called Commander [EDH] which is much cheaper to play, stops a lot of silly combos as you can only have 1 of each card and its just more fun really.

What I do like about Magic in general is that its so easy to pick up and play/pack away etc. Quite often when we are sat around after doing something else we will just have a few games as its so easy to get a game going. I think its well worth doing if its something your group would be into just as a little side game to pass the time now and again and if you all keep it casual and not put loads of money into it and go for killer decks it can stay very fun.

Duel Decks are often a fun way of getting into the game. Its sets they release with 2 decks in and each deck has a certain theme, ive had lots of fun just using the original decks from duel deck sets against a person using the other.

If your looking to start, the duel deck 'Phyrexia vs the Coalition' is probably the cheapest [can get it for as low as £8 new usually] and I really enjoyed the completely different playstyles in the decks.

Its not even that really, its just a really cool full on campaign with fluff to go along with it. It just introduces the other units as it goes along. The first Chaos mission is actually 1 player where you try and disable your own Dreadnought as it goes crazy but your trying to not actually kill it.

I think its the best they have done so far although as has been said, its a shame they didn't make the Marines Vanilla. Or at least just had the DA iconography as clip on. The Chaos models work great for any chaos force though.

The characters are some of the best character models in the game IMO.

Non-GW Games / Re: Magic: The Gathering
« on: March 14, 2014, 11:07:00 PM »
Your pretty much always better opening the packs and then putting each card into the search engine on a site like Magic Madhouse to get their value, I cant tell what set it is from the cover but some sets have very expensive cards in, particularly older sets like this as the very best cards retain their value for formats of the game that use most card sets.

As I cant really tell what it is though it may be one of those sets where you don't get any rares, which would be a problem as that's were the value is. What does it say on the packs that you actually get?

Brilliant value.

I think the models are actually way better than a lot of models out there despite the one pose option, the detail on them is fantastic.

What I think really makes it though is the additional booklet that has a whole campaign you can play through using just the two forces in the box that escalates as it goes along. I think that's a great addition and makes it into a pretty decent stand alone game in its own right, you pay that kind of price for top end board games but your getting way more models than normal!.

Wow, those Ogryns are terrible! why on earth have they done them again when the last lot were actually amazing models? The last lot were some of the best ogre sized models ive ever seen from GW. These things are up there with that possessed release before the current lot.

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