6th Edition WTFs?

[Chicop76]

Regarding moving vehciles, disembarking and then shooting- i beliive that disembarking (as embarking) is now up to 6" from the hull, which is pretty good! And my way of fluff-justifying the 'cannot assault from vehicles' (stationary or moving) is that non assault-vehicles usually have rear or side mounted entry points and are not large enough to quickly cram a load of peeps out all at the one time. Whereas with a Landraider or Stormraven- open the front hatch, roll up and chuck on the brakes- out they roll...

Also, Power weapons- i cant agree Chicop, for too long beating armour was a yes or no proposition- the current setup with differences, bonuses and modifiers is more like Second Ed but in a streamlined way.

Whilst I dont agree with Axes needing to be unwieldy (should just be -1 In IMO), I do agree with the Str Bonus. Looking to kit out some of my Sgts or Vets now with Axes and Meltabombs for some flexibility when dealing with Armour and MCs instead of just relying on a Fist. In some cases it may even come in cheaper, depending what squad it is.

I feel a bit indifferent about the power weapon bit. The problem I have is it changes a lot on several units. For example Paladins get a super buff and expect to see them striking at int 6 more than ever. While regular terminators get a raw deal. Assault terminators will be taken less for the slow weilding powerfist and encorage getting getting the storm shield more so and almost making power claw terminators almost nonusable. Units like Banshees will now take a back seat to Harliquins, etc. The ap 3 change hits a lot of melee armies hard and make the +2 save nastier in combat which some armies have to rely more on plasma weapons over melee weapons.

Paladins did not need a buff since they was op to begin with. I like specalising the weapons a bit more to make them less bland, but do it in a balancing way instead of buffing some armies and hurting some.

In retrospect the now chaos update helped fix the gap with most of khorne being ap 3 instead of 2. Even though screamers are much better than they use to be it is not the same as letters and crushers. Honestly speaking they are much better for what they cost.

[Tom]

Regarding moving vehciles, disembarking and then shooting- i beliive that disembarking (as embarking) is now up to 6" from the hull, which is pretty good!

Now the vehicle can't have moved more than 6" though, so the threat range is still the same (although there was the 2" disembarkation previously after the transport moved 12" making 14" just...) yet now with vehilces being more vulnerable to close combat attacks it certainly is useful to get your soldiers out in from of their transport sometimes... funny that it used to be the other way around. I think I prefer it this way but it's not really a huge difference.

I think spotlights are a WTF too. Before you had to roll night fight to see the target and than illuminate it. Now all you do is shot first and than illuminate what ever target you like. The only bad side effect is you can not get a cover save when you do so. My problem is if you have a squad of Harlequins with a night seer heading down the middle of the board. All I have to do is put a light on them and no more cover save with or without night fight in place.

I think you might have made a mistake Chicop, the searchlight rule I'm seeing in front of me says that a vehicle with a searchlight "can, after firing all of its weapons, choose to illuminate its target with the searchlight" (my emphasis) not just anything. It also says that "Illuminated units gain no benefit from the Night Fighting special rule" not that they lose their cover saves full stop.

[Charistoph]

Walker shooting took a bit of a nerf.  Before, you could unload with everything, no problem, no matter how far you moved (ordnance being the only exception).  Now, if you move, only one is fully effective, the rest are Snap-Fired.

Could we be seeing more one-handed Dreadnoughts coming out?  Or will they be platforms only?

Twin-Linked Snap-Fire will not take you very far...

[Chicop76]

Walker shooting took a bit of a nerf.  Before, you could unload with everything, no problem, no matter how far you moved (ordnance being the only exception).  Now, if you move, only one is fully effective, the rest are Snap-Fired.

Could we be seeing more one-handed Dreadnoughts coming out?  Or will they be platforms only?

Twin-Linked Snap-Fire will not take you very far...

My WTF is Venerable Dreadnaughts. I mean why bother taking them if they can shrug off badd effects, but still earn missing hull points. Venerable is now a wasted model to take.

Also units like my Soul Grinder took a hit. Before units like Genestealers could only glance it to death while being immune to rolls 2 and under. Now it losses hull points which means a lucky unit can kill it. Although I had stealers immobilize or weapon destroy my baby it was still alive. Now they can actually kill it.

[Matt1785]

Ugh, I am totally behind you on the Venerable Dread... unbelievable.  I agree that the use of the dread is almost completely useless as who cares that you re-roll it?  You still lost a hull point so you're still going to die.

So far I have been lucky that the hull point system hasn't really factored into my games, but overall I know that HP are sucking for some of the heavier vehicle armies... ugh.

[crisis_vyper]

Ugh, I am totally behind you on the Venerable Dread... unbelievable.  I agree that the use of the dread is almost completely useless as who cares that you re-roll it?  You still lost a hull point so you're still going to die.

So far I have been lucky that the hull point system hasn't really factored into my games, but overall I know that HP are sucking for some of the heavier vehicle armies... ugh.

The Close combat Dread is essentially nullified as a result of the fact that if the unit that they are charging can't hurt it in any way, they would be able to run away rather than being tarpitted against the Dread. As for the shooty dread, it still have its uses especially the Psyflemen.

[Matt1785]

I'm not sure though, to get away from a close combat dread you have to auto fail your retreat... which is dangerous unless you're a Marine or similar that don't care if you're swept up.  I feel that Blood Angels dreads are still in good shape being AV13.

I suppose the Psyfleman is still good, but I just like getting my dread up close and personal.. which does not work well for me... not unless I can get the ironclad I suppose.. but then there is no long ranged shooting from it.  I refuse to Psyfle up!  Dang.

[Mabbz]

Here's a weird thing from the allies rules:

Allies of convenience and desperate allies count as enemies that can't be targetted is more or less what the rule says. This means, unless I'm mistaken, that if my Tau start to flee and I have a guard unit (allied) within 6", my Tau can't rally. If that's the case then it probably affects other things too, but I haven't looked into it.

[The Man They Call Jayne]

Wont Bonding Knives fix that though?

[Mabbz]

Wont Bonding Knives fix that though?

That only lets you regroup whilst below half strength (unless they changed it in an errata)

[Warptide]

Seeing a squad of Khorne berserkers fail a 3" charge in open terrain is probably my biggest WTF in 6th ed.

However overall my greatest WTF is from the over-abundance of flyers and the inability to deal with them with my armies. (aside from ignoring, which is hit or a miss)

[Cammerz]

However overall my greatest WTF is from the over-abundance of flyers and the inability to deal with them with my armies. (aside from ignoring, which is hit or a miss)

I'd like to point out that any army (even 'nids) can take fortifications, many of which allow the additional purchase of anti-air quad guns or icarus lascannons. So there is still some hope for those armies which currently lack flyers.

Another option is to get the new book of flyers from Forge World, then every army will be able to have flyers or FMCs (probably).

[Matt1785]

@Mabbz,

There are no longer rules preventing regrouping even if units are within 6", that was all 5th Edition and is no longer relevant.  The only thing that can stop regrouping is failing morale to regroup... which in my mind is great, I always hated the idea of being escorted off the table just because a unit was close to me... I mean, come on.  (This all of course unless I am missing something posted in the book AFTER the regrouping section).

[Warptide]

1 or 2 aegis defence lines is not NEAR enough to take out lists with 3 or more flyers in them.

[Cammerz]

1 or 2 aegis defence lines is not NEAR enough to take out lists with 3 or more flyers in them.

Well just get a large horde, enough S4+ shots and you can glance any flyer out of the sky. Or units like Ork Lootas, CSM Havocs (probably autocannons), IG HWTs (also probably autocannons), Tau stealthsuits (burst cannons might be quite good this edition).
Also, given the reliability of reserves, you probably won't be seeing all of your opponent's flyers at the same time, just systematically take them out before the others show up.