Author Topic: 2S Tau Empire Codex - 6th Edition Restart  (Read 36376 times)

Offline Wargamer

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Re: 2S Tau Empire Codex - 6th Edition Restart
« Reply #30 on: July 14, 2012, 10:36:03 PM »
Okay, some thoughts:

First off, the Tau have already received a power boost in 5th due to the new Rapid Fire rules. Not only can they outrange most people whilst remaining mobile (remember, that extra 6" means you effectively get a 'free' turn of shooting), but the fact that Rapid Fire is now 2 shots at half range, not 12", means they can sit back out of the enemy's optimum range and unleash hell. Before anyone says "but the other guys can just move 3-6" and shoot back!" consider what those inches might actually mean; 3" is the difference between holding an objective and not, between being in cover and not, between being out of charge range of a Kroot unit or not.

In addition, Snap Fire indirectly benefits the Tau more than most. Tau have the single best standard weapon in the game; the Pulse Rifle. At str 5 it is enough to make even a Space Marine think twice about whether they can laugh it off. They can also, point for point, put more bodies down than Marines can. That means that, on paper at least, Tau should have a stronger overwatch than Marines. I know its not much - around one extra kill per ten Firewarriors, but how many combats have been won and lost by having one extra man in the press?

Overall, out of all the core Infantry, I'd say Firewarriors have benefited the most from 6th's changes.



Realistically, I'd say all the Tau need for 6th is to be given a Barracuda, and to have a few adjustments made to their rules. The things that spring to mind for me are:

  • Target Lock (the one that lets you split fire with squads) needs to be changed to grant the ability in the 6th Edition rulebook that allows a single model to fire at a different unit. The moment I saw that I was convinced it was written just for the Tau.
  • Apply various alterations mentioned in the FAQ (ie: Stealthsuits gaining Stealth and Shrouded).
  • Make Krootox T6 again.

That's... well, that's the bulk of what's needed. No 'Razorback'fish, no trying to put other Caste members onto the table, no making up whole new units to fill a tactical niche that only exists in the head of the author. Update some rules and tweak some points, and the Tau Codex will be a scary thing to face on the table without being broken, or stupidly fanboyish.
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Offline El ShasOcho

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Re: 2S Tau Empire Codex - 6th Edition Restart
« Reply #31 on: July 15, 2012, 01:53:41 AM »
I agree a lot with what Wargamer has said here. 6th has mostly buffed shooting and weakened CC, which is purely benefit for Tau since we never want to be in combat. We don't need a ton of things I think, just the addition of a flyer, either a barracuda or something similar, some adjustments to fit in with new rules (target locks, skyfire on some weapons like sky ray perhaps, etc.) and they should be golden.

That said, I see nothing wrong with adding some fun things in the 2Sdex, since this is for fun. While things like the devil-backs isn't necessary for a balanced 6th ed tau codex, it is a fun addition if priced correctly.

Although, it must be said, one should always have a Fantasy in

Offline Narric

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Re: 2S Tau Empire Codex - 6th Edition Restart
« Reply #32 on: July 15, 2012, 05:36:29 AM »
Sounds like we simply need to make a Second Sphere Errata for Tau.
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Offline midas

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Re: 2S Tau Empire Codex - 6th Edition Restart
« Reply #33 on: July 15, 2012, 02:13:31 PM »
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The OPTION to take one would be fine....

I have always been a fan of the Skyray being given to the pathfinders...

The devilfish also lacks any kind of decent weaponry...

The option for a TL battlesuit weapon on the turret would make it immensly more useful. The fact that you cant fire out of it is also a bugger because it's "pressurised" which is a stupid argument once you have reached groud level. And if you take a penetrating hit over the course of the game, you are no longer pressurised anyway.

A Skyray with an 8 man capacity id not unreasonable. Account for some bracing for the roof and some tagetting computers and you can justify losing 4 people.
'Fish being mandatory is nonsense, since ppl fill them with warriors if they want. I second making that an option. Skyray attachment is a bit overpowered imho.
Turret for the fish is not necessary either, and would be very much a copy of the imperial vehicles out there.

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- Agree on the general trends and goals before going into details such as point costs for vehicle upgrades.
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Offline Scout Sergeant Mkoll

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Re: 2S Tau Empire Codex - 6th Edition Restart
« Reply #34 on: July 16, 2012, 12:53:58 PM »
I would say make the Devilfish chassis 60 points.
60 seems too cheap for me personally. It's armour 12, with jink. A Raider costs that much and, while it is fast, it's 2 armour points lower on front and side.

Skyfire for the Ion Cannon makes sense, no problems there.
Devilfish optional for Pathfinders makes sense.
I would second the vote on no for a Turretfish. Not because it's a copy if Imperial vehicles or anythung, but because given the number of suits you can fit into an army with those weapon options anyway it seems a bit redundant.
Krootox back to their original toughness would be fine by me. (I thought they were T5 initially, but whichever it was is fine)
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Offline Charistoph

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Re: 2S Tau Empire Codex - 6th Edition Restart
« Reply #35 on: July 16, 2012, 05:30:55 PM »
Krootox were T 5(3), which would still make them the same as they currently are, for all intents and purposes.

One thought I would propose, drop the Shaper's W to 1, A to 2, and points to a 10 point upgrade.  This allows the higher Shapers a finer distinction, as well easily allowing for an upgrade instead of such a weighty consideration.
« Last Edit: July 16, 2012, 05:34:27 PM by Charistoph »
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Offline Cammerz

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Re: 2S Tau Empire Codex - 6th Edition Restart
« Reply #36 on: July 16, 2012, 07:19:49 PM »
Krootox were T 5(3), which would still make them the same as they currently are, for all intents and purposes.

In 3rd edition Krootox were T3(5), which would of course make them T5 in the current ruleset (which makes more sense than T3) although we can always hide them in the middle of a large unit of kroot and hope the enemy don't have snipers to target them.
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Offline Charistoph

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Re: 2S Tau Empire Codex - 6th Edition Restart
« Reply #37 on: July 16, 2012, 07:56:57 PM »
Krootox were T 5(3), which would still make them the same as they currently are, for all intents and purposes.

In 3rd edition Krootox were T3(5), which would of course make them T5 in the current ruleset (which makes more sense than T3) although we can always hide them in the middle of a large unit of kroot and hope the enemy don't have snipers to target them.

I could have sworn it was T5(3).  T5 for the Ox, (3) for the rider.  It's what I get for posting the stats with my codex collection at a different location.
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Offline Cammerz

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Re: 2S Tau Empire Codex - 6th Edition Restart
« Reply #38 on: July 16, 2012, 10:58:54 PM »
Krootox were T 5(3), which would still make them the same as they currently are, for all intents and purposes.

In 3rd edition Krootox were T3(5), which would of course make them T5 in the current ruleset (which makes more sense than T3) although we can always hide them in the middle of a large unit of kroot and hope the enemy don't have snipers to target them.

I could have sworn it was T5(3).  T5 for the Ox, (3) for the rider.  It's what I get for posting the stats with my codex collection at a different location.

It all counts as one model, the 5 part was the main toughness but the 3 was used for purposes of instant death (much like marine bikers which were T4(5). The simple way to remember it is that the smaller number goes first).
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Offline Narric

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Re: 2S Tau Empire Codex - 6th Edition Restart
« Reply #39 on: July 16, 2012, 11:13:15 PM »
I have the old Chapter Approved of the Kroot Mercenary list. Cammerz is right.

However, in the current rules of Codex: Tau Empire, the Krootox is ignored, and only the "Riders" stats are used for Toughness, but the model uses the Krootox's Strength in combat. It also had triple to wounds of a regular Kroot.

Could we do something for the Krootox, which makes them work something similar to a Imperial Guard Heavy Weapons team? Probably excluding the part where we trade two Kroot for a Krootox.
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Offline Carrelio

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Re: 2S Tau Empire Codex - 6th Edition Restart
« Reply #40 on: August 14, 2012, 12:38:51 AM »
For the challenges in balance it would cause, and the super buffs of the current sniper weapon I think it might be easier if we were to simply drop the rail rifle in favour of the sniper rifle.  At the end of the day, they are basically the same.  One is a little stronger, one always wounds on a 4+.  One is AP3, one has rending.  The differences are pretty small, and we'd gain more than we lost.  I already play an allied contingent of eldar pathfinders because they fill a niche we can't, I say we just go all the way with it.

For anti-air, I think we shouldn't just go giving everything in our heavy support sky-fire/interceptor.  Our skyray was designed to take out flyers, so lets let it do that.  Our smaller flyers (remoras and barracudas) were meant to rule the skys so let's let them do that.  Maybe throw in some turret mounted anti-air... but I'd say we definitely shouldn't go overboard on the skyfire considering how rare it is amongst other armies.

Kroot definitely could do with some interesting stuff (as always). I'm digging the idea of krootox weapon teams.  Maybe bring back individual traits like the old tyranid book/chapter approved kroot?

Offline The Man They Call Jayne

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Re: 2S Tau Empire Codex - 6th Edition Restart
« Reply #41 on: August 14, 2012, 12:41:40 AM »
Now that Drone Turrets are availiable, they could be upgraded with Skyfire.
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Offline Wargamer

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Re: 2S Tau Empire Codex - 6th Edition Restart
« Reply #42 on: August 14, 2012, 09:07:29 AM »
For anti-air, make the Skyray's markerlight a skyfire weapon. It was never meant as an artillery piece, so just give it back its original role. Against ground units, it provides a nice big seeker missile collection for them to call in.
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Offline Charistoph

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Re: 2S Tau Empire Codex - 6th Edition Restart
« Reply #43 on: August 14, 2012, 05:47:42 PM »
Now that Drone Turrets are availiable, they could be upgraded with Skyfire.

Or mayhaps Skyfire Drones?

That doesn't quite work right in my head for some reason...  Unless they were Skyfire ML Drones that called offboard Seekers...
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Offline midas

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Re: 2S Tau Empire Codex - 6th Edition Restart
« Reply #44 on: August 14, 2012, 06:25:48 PM »
how about somebody decides to start with the thing OVERALL, before such small details are discussed like skyfire on the skyray or not.

 

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