Poll

To 'Toof:  Now that I've seen your wares, I want up next:

Grumgutz and Lorilune (Orkz/Eldar)
4 (44.4%)
Vasily and Princess Sara (IG/Tau)
1 (11.1%)
Y'stral and Thielbane (DE/E)
2 (22.2%)
Rolf and Agatha (SW/GK)
2 (22.2%)

Total Members Voted: 9

Author Topic: Space Wolves vs Dark Eldar in "Old Friends, New Horrors" (1500, 8/11/12)  (Read 4796 times)

Offline BigToof

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Space Wolves vs Dark Eldar in "Old Friends, New Horrors" (1500, 8/11/12)
----------------------

Hi All,
I've got a bit of a... well, I'm not sure if I would call it fun, but certainly entertaining game.  It's my sort of reworked Space Wolves with "help" versus Dark Eldar with some... infernal assistance.

I wracked my brain on the fluff for this, so I hope you all like it.  (Thank goodness I at least convinced my opponent to take out the Harlequins...)

I would... appreciate comments, criticism and general advice on lists, tactics, strategy, deployment and what-not, as this was a bit of a tragedy in more ways than one :)

Best,
-BT


----------------
The Lists
----------------
Space Wolves/Grey Knights (1500pts): 36 Infantry, 3 Vehicles; 13 VPs
Space Wolves
-Wolf Lord Rolf Blacktooth (WL w/TWolf, PF, SS, SofBear, Runic Armor)
-Rune Priest Harald "Mad Harry" Runesmith (RP w/Runic Armor)
-Grey Huntersx5 w/Plasmagun in Rhino
-Grey Huntersx5 w/Flamer in Las/Plas Razorback
-Grey Huntersx5 w/Flamer in Las/Plas Razorback
-Thunderwolf Calvaryx3 w/PF,SS
-Long Fangsx5 w/MLx4
-Long Fangsx5 w/MLx4
Inquisition
-Lady Agatha Brimstone (OM Inquisitor w/Term Armor, Psycannon, Force Sword/Psyker)
-GK Terminatorsx5 w/Psycannon, Halbardsx2, Hammersx2, Justicar w/Sword

Dark Eldar/Daemons: 1500pts, 37 Infantry, 5 Vehicles, 1MC; 14 KPs
The Wicked Talon Kabal
-Lady D'ysperax (Archon w/Huskblade, Power Axe, Shadow Field, CD, ST)
-Grotesquesx3 w/LG, Aberrant w/Scissorhand in Raider w/EnAethersails
-Warriorsx5 w/Blaster in Venom w/SCx2
-Warriorsx5 w/Blaster in Venom w/SCx2
-Beastmastersx3 w/Khymaraex4, Razorwingsx4
-Scourgesx5 w/Heatlancesx2
-Voidraven Bomber w/Shatterfield Missilesx2
-Voidraven Bomber w/Shatterfield Missilesx2
Chaos Daemons
-Bloodthirster
-Nurglingsx3
-Screamersx4

---------------------
Chapter One: The Power of Love
---------------------
Lady D'ysperax, Archon of the wicked Talon Kabal, smiled, looking at the reddish orb resting neatly in the palm of her hand.  It seemed so small, so innocent, certainly not a forbidden, horrible terror that had lied deep within one of Lord Vect's hidden vaults.

Then again, in the Dark City, appearances were nearly always deceiving.  She looked around at the small warband that she had managed to gather together.  None of the others who had gotten wind of her scheme had wanted to be anywhere near her.  Not that she blamed them, of course.  A mere century ago, she would have called such action madness.

But that was before her poppet, Commander Vasily Romanov, had walked into her life.

He was so full of torment, fear and pain, that merely being around him was a cornucopia of delicious suffering.  But, he was well protected and still truly unaware of his proper station as her future pet.  All she would need is time to properly educate him, which was rather hard with all of those Mon'Keigh and their silly guns. 

She had thus crafted her latest plan.  It was a plan borne of love, she told herself.  A kind of romance that only an Eldar would understand.  And appreciate.  To a lesser race, it would just seem like nihilism on a grand scale.

The orb pulsed again.  Her smile transformed into a smirk.  She had planned out the proceedings accordingly.  A few words to people she knew, and within the reliably predictable amount of time, the sacrifices had come.  After all, blood would be needed to start anything important and much more would be spilled before the day's end.

---------------------
The small unmarked vessel emerged from the Warp near Deneb Prime.  Although plain in appearance, the contents of the vessel were anything but.

Lady Agatha Brimstone, Agent of the Inquisition checked the sensor readouts.  She was about to reach out with her third eye when a wave of nausea and revulsion hit her.  They were in the proper place, no doubt about that now.

"Agatha?  Are you alright?"

She glanced up to a see the worried, familiar face of Lord Rolf Blacktooth.

She managed a weak smile, "Well enough Mister Blacktooth, well enough.  We have arrived, luckily before any major damage has been done."

The Wolf Lord nodded, only relaxing his guard after a few moments.  He was pleasantly surprised to hear the message from Agatha.  It had been months since he had seen her last, but the Inquisitor did have the habit of disappearing for... whatever it was that Inquisitors were doing.  Although most of the Space Wolves disliked the Inquisition for perfectly reasonable reasons, Rolf had found Agatha to be a trustworthy companion.  Sometimes he wished that they could be more...  But that would have to be another life.  Now, the Wolves needed him, and Agatha had said that something grave and horrible was going on and needed the bravery and heroism of his warriors.

Actually, Rolf admitted to himself, she didn't say anything about bravery and heroism, more of something like "adequate distractions," but he knew what she meant.  After all, what could possibly stand against the might of the Space Wolves?

Agatha noticed that Rolf had fallen into one of his optimistic daydreams, and maybe that was for the best.  After all, it wouldn't help matters to let him know that she was going to be forced to send one of her dearest friends into a meat grinder so that she would have a chance at stopping the Universe itself from tearing asunder.  She bit her lip, fighting back the vestiges of emotions that she had been keeping down for days.  The good of the many outweigh the good of the few.  If she was lucky.

"Mister Rolf?  Please assemble your men.  The planet awaits..."

---------------------
Setup: Vanguard (Triangle), Night Fight off (good)
Mission: Relic (Uh... not so good?)
Warlord: Rolf: Furious Charge in opponent's zone, Lady D: Can reroll reserves (Oh... that's... bad)
---------------------

Pre-Game thoughts: Lady D lists are always a combination of sadism and confusion.  So I am trying not to be beset by both.  Trying, mind you.  Ok... so... It has flyers, which is bad for me, as my list is very light on anti-flyer technology.  Hopefully I can just avoid them.  The Bloodthirster is bad.  Lady D is arguably worse.  But I think Rolf and the Thunderwolves can take both in assault.  I have a lot of shooty, and I can confidently take out the Dark Eldar one on one in a straight up shoot-out.  I don't think I'm going to get it, but here's hoping.  I've also got more troops who are more durable, although slower.

So... game plan: Setup a forward castle with as much defense as possible.  Shoot whatever comes in.  Assault to clean up.  Sounds pretty simple...

---------------------

To be continued!

----------------------
« Last Edit: August 12, 2012, 12:35:41 AM by BigToof »
BigToof Points:

Cammerz: 8
Waaaghpower: 1
The Man They Call Jayne: 3
Mabbz: 6
Archon Sharrek: 3

Offline Cammerz

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Great to see Agatha back again BT, as i recall she was around way back when Inquisitorial allies were allowed, before they weren't, but now they are again, yay!

It'll take me a little while to refresh my memory of all the Space Wolf characters but I remember mad Harry being a great character (I sadly can't remember why, but I'm sure I'll be reminded eventually). And to top it all off, everyone's favourite character; Lady D.
If it was any other DE Archon I would scoff at your suggestion that it was worse than a mighty Bloodthirster of Khorne (especially given the new rules for flying monstrous creatures) but there's just something aboout her which makes me agree with you wholeheartedly.

All of the Lady's flying goodies are probably your main weakness for this battle, whilst thos transports probably won't help too much (hopefully they can carry a unit or two far enough forwards to capture that relic early in the game). Perhaps a bastion with a skyfiring quad-gun would help more, and then the relic squad could take cover inside for most of the game.

Now, given that this is the Space Wolves (notoriously your unluckiest army given that they have a tendency to occasionally lose), I'm tempted to say that the Lady might pull a fast one here and snatch a rare victory, but we can always hope that Rolf will, at the very least, scrape a draw.

The rest will be good, I'm looking forward to it.

EDIT: Oh, and as for the poll, I'd like to see all of the options in an equal number of reports, at least enough for us to fully get to grips with the new 6th ed story lines, then maybe you can start focusing on certain armies more often if you'd prefer. As for the next report, lets just have them in the order that you've listed them. So Orks first, and my vote has gone that way.
« Last Edit: August 12, 2012, 12:46:54 AM by Cammerz »
Ahh Cammerz has typed himself into oblivion! :o Someone get him back xD

Offline Chicop76

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I just wanted to point out that your greyknights could be the worst unit to melee the blodthirster. The bloodthirster can take a very cheap upgrade called blessing of Chaos. This upgrade. Can allow the Blodthirster to save against force and psi attacks with a + 2 save. Which means he will have a + 2 invulneable against your grey knights in combat.

 

Offline BigToof

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Hi All,
Sorry, been deathly ill lately, though mostly better now.  Will try to get the rep up soon.

Thank you all for the fine comments!

Great to see Agatha back again BT, as i recall she was around way back when Inquisitorial allies were allowed, before they weren't, but now they are again, yay!

It'll take me a little while to refresh my memory of all the Space Wolf characters but I remember mad Harry being a great character (I sadly can't remember why, but I'm sure I'll be reminded eventually). And to top it all off, everyone's favourite character; Lady D.
If it was any other DE Archon I would scoff at your suggestion that it was worse than a mighty Bloodthirster of Khorne (especially given the new rules for flying monstrous creatures) but there's just something aboout her which makes me agree with you wholeheartedly.

All of the Lady's flying goodies are probably your main weakness for this battle, whilst thos transports probably won't help too much (hopefully they can carry a unit or two far enough forwards to capture that relic early in the game). Perhaps a bastion with a skyfiring quad-gun would help more, and then the relic squad could take cover inside for most of the game.

Now, given that this is the Space Wolves (notoriously your unluckiest army given that they have a tendency to occasionally lose), I'm tempted to say that the Lady might pull a fast one here and snatch a rare victory, but we can always hope that Rolf will, at the very least, scrape a draw.

The rest will be good, I'm looking forward to it.

EDIT: Oh, and as for the poll, I'd like to see all of the options in an equal number of reports, at least enough for us to fully get to grips with the new 6th ed story lines, then maybe you can start focusing on certain armies more often if you'd prefer. As for the next report, lets just have them in the order that you've listed them. So Orks first, and my vote has gone that way.

Hi Cammerz,
It was very nostalgic to see Agatha again, although she did do... interesting things in this battle :)
At least she's much different than the old anti-Deep Strike universal Hood that she was previously.  Hope you like the Wolves as well :)
Orks next, eh?
Alright, I'll see what I can do...

I just wanted to point out that your greyknights could be the worst unit to melee the blodthirster. The bloodthirster can take a very cheap upgrade called blessing of Chaos. This upgrade. Can allow the Blodthirster to save against force and psi attacks with a + 2 save. Which means he will have a + 2 invulneable against your grey knights in combat.

Hi Chicop,
That bloodthirster...
I...
Oh, I do not have words for that beast.
Actually, I do, but this is a family program :)

Best,
-BT
BigToof Points:

Cammerz: 8
Waaaghpower: 1
The Man They Call Jayne: 3
Mabbz: 6
Archon Sharrek: 3

Offline BigToof

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Hi All,
Here's the rest of the rep.

And let it be said that 'Toof is not gracious in his not-victories.
He just... wishes they weren't so painful.

C&C greatly appreciated, especially in this one.

Best,
-BT

----------------------

Setup: Well, there are good and bad things to the new setup methods.  One is the fact that since the amount of terrain is random, there will be times when you don't have a lot of terrain.  Hence the case in this game, when almost all of the 6 2x2 areas had only 1-2 pieces.  Wolves won the roll to go first, and I took the only real ruin and put it in the front of what I knew was going to be my half.  The DE went and put a big crater/rubble piece in their half.  Scattered rubble went around to the rest of the quarters, giving a decent amount (but not a lot) of 5+ cover.  So... yeah, this is going to be a shooting match.
The Wolves won the roll to decide who goes first, and I think for a bit, but with only one decent piece of terrain, I'd be crazy not to take it.  So the Wolves choose to go first, deploying the Rhino and Razorbacks behind the ruin, and the Thunderwolves with Rolf behind them.  I decide to go with Divination for both Agatha and Harry, and go with Primaris for both.  I put Harry in the Rhino and Agatha and the Terminators in reserve.  I'm not really sure where to put the Long Fangs, and after some thought, I put them between the tanks.  My reasoning was that I could still get decent shots and the tanks would prevent any flanking shenanigans.
The DE put a lot in reserve, only deploying the Beasts as far forwards as possible, and the two Venoms and the Raider (with Lady and the Grots!) to the far right.  I think I can still shoot at them, but they're out of range from some of my units.  Fair enough.

And then it all hits the fan when the DE steal initiative!


Picture Caption: And now, I'm screwed.
--------------------

Turn 1: DE
--------------------
Lady D'ysperax watched the Space Wolves set up their defenses behind the once proud Mon'Keigh ruin.  They didn't seem aware of what was in store for them.  Some where actually singing.  She glanced over to the center of their battlefield where the hidden crimson orb pulsed just under the small bank of snow that was conveniently hiding it.  She wondered if she would know when it would do... whatever it was supposed to do.  It would be a bother if Lord Vect had lied, and just put her into a dangerous situation just to have her killed.

Then the ground shook, and the reddish orb leapt upwards, stopping about chest height before letting loose with enormous lightning-like blasts of energy that tore great gaping holes in the sky.

Things began to crawl and fly out.

Lady D'ysperax smirked a bit, as she felt an ancestral dread overcome her.

Daemons.  There were here.
-------------------

Lady D rolls for her Daemons and gets her perferred wave, which is the Bloodthirster (ah) and the Screamers.  The Thirster deep strikes into my BACKFIELD.  (Uh... wha?) and the screamers go up the left flank.  Lady D activates her sais and goes down the right.  Venoms move up.  The Venoms riddle one of the Long Fangs down to the squad leader, who decides to stay around.


Picture Caption: That's... a really big one.

Turn 1: SW
--------------------
Harald "Mad Harry" Runesmith was taking a bit of snooze in his Rhino.  It had been a long night, what with all the alcohol needed to keep from dismembering the Inquisition stooges that they had been forced to stick in with.  Luckily, the Inquisitors had decided not to accompany the Wolves to the surface, which suited Harry fine.

Everything was rosy, until a great gut-shattering tremor went through the ground and a roaring sound like a pack of hungry Thunderwolves all going off at one time echoed through the air.

"Stop the tank!" barked Harry as he popped his head out of the turrent.  Glancing down, he saw young Rolf looking up at something.  In fact, the lot of them were.  He looked around and squinted a few times with both eyes to make sure it looked the same.
"Lad," he said to Rolf, "Is that a Bloodthirster up there or did I drink from the wrong keg again?"

"No," replied Lord Bloodtooth in a voice that had a kind of forced calmness to it, "That's... a Bloodthirster alright.  It's... rather... big."

Harry nodded.  "Huh, they can fly up there now?  That's different.  No worries, lad, I'll have it brought down then you can punch it back to the Warp.  Lads!  Get ready!  We're going to go Daemon Huntin'!"
---------------------

Something in my brain sort of snapped at this point.

Part of me was evaluating what to do about the incoming Lady D and her squad of destrucion and you know...  all of the Beasts and what-not.

The other part was screaming and pointing at the Greater Daemon that was ready to do unkind things to my rear.  And I like my rear, you know.

So, I disembark Harry and all of the Grey Hunters.  I decide to try and speedbump with the Rhino and move it up 6" with smoke just out of habit.

The single Long Fang moves in a bit, and so does the Razor on the right side, to give more space for the squad to shoot at the Raider.

Harry passes his psyker check and now I have re-rollable bolters!  They hit the Bloodthirster three times, wound once, which does... nothing as he stays aloft.
That's not good.  The Grey Hunters on the right try their luck.  Also nothing.
The Long Fangs give it a go.  Nothing.  Finally the left Razorback fires and finally grounds the Bloodthirster and give him his second wound.

I fire the Grey Hunters on the left at the Screamers and down two.  The Razor on the right fires at Lady D's Raider, but she makes her cover saves.

Rolf charges in with his Thunderwolves ready to pulverize the big beastie, but the Bloodthirster challenges!  I uh... am sort of forced to accept with Rolf as the little Thunderwolves won't stand a chance otherwise.  Rolf takes a wound, but deals out a respectable three, but the beast makes most of its saves, and still has one left!


Picture Caption: Bloodthirster's too pumped up!


Turn 2: DE
--------------------
There was a roaring sound from the sky just moments before purplish crackles of energy exploded the Space Marine tanks, throwing them into the air like toys.

Lady D'ysperax smiled, watching more carnage play out in front of her as Shatterfield missiles gave off their renowned plumes of ice and fire, throwing the Mon'Keigh around like children in a whirlwind.

She took a moment to stretch and look for her first victims.  The Marines were always so easy to trap.  You just needed the right bait...
------------------
And thanks to her Warlord trait, pretty much everything comes in.  Both the Void Ravens take an oblique approach, and I'm more than a bit surprised that they can actually see the back of my ruin!

The screamers move up, so do the beasts.  Lady D's Raider immobilizes itself on some rocks, but it doesn't matter, as the Archon is now in point blank range.
The Void Ravens start the pain, blowing up both Razorbacks with contemptuous ease and slagging a handful of Grey Hunters.  The Venoms add to the mayhem, cleaning up the last of the right Long Fang squad and whittling down the Grey Hunters to only a few each.  Harry, in particular, is now by himself. 

Assault is pretty horrific.

Lady D charges in and murders all of the right Grey Hunters with her Grots.  The left squad has only a few members left, who manage to down a Screamer, but get taken apart for their troubles.  The Bloodthirster surprises us all by smashing Rolf down with five wounds!  The Thunderwolves for some reason decide to stay.  The Beasts assault in, hitting the Long fangs and the errant rhino.  one of the Beastmasters challenges the squad leader, doing nothing and then being beaten down by the old wolf in return.  Two of the Long Fangs fall, it wasn't looking so good... then the Rhino EXPLODES doing a corona of wounds to the surrounding beasts.

Now down by quite a bit, the beasts (without beastmasters thanks to the explosion) run and the Long Fangs can't catch them.


Picture Caption: Uh... this is bad.


Turn 2: SW
----------------
Lady Agatha Brimstone shut off her auspex as the casualties started to mount.  Rolf had already fallen.  She bit her lip to silence her growing apprehension.  There was a mission at hand, and the fate of humanity was at stake.  Certainly the trust and lives of a few replaceable allies was nothing in comparison?

But then again, tears in reality were much more commonplace than previous.  Inquisitors themselves used the forces of the Warp against the forces of Chaos, and even the most highly-regarded Grey Knights harnessed the Warp with more frequency than the most black-hearted of Sorcerers.  Was it really worth the cost?  Was a difference really being made?

"Inquisitor.  The coordinates are set.  The time to act is nigh."

Agatha glanced up to see the stern face of the Grey Knight Justicar.  She nodded.  As tenuous of a lot in life, it was hers.  And the blood spilled this day would be on her hands.
-----------------

I get Agatha in and she drops in fairly on target to the back of the relic.
She sprays a Venom and it dies spectacularly, destroying most of the Warriors on-board.  The far-away Long Fangs throw down a pair of missiles that catch the other Venom, also tearing it to shreds.  Only a few Warriors are left from one squad that fail their morale and head back.

I have almost nothing in the backfield, but I have to try and hold up Lady D.  I hope against hope and throw Harry against her Grot-star, but it's all for naught as she makes short work of him.  The Thirster, meanwhile, continues his rampage by declaring SMASH.
I wasn't familiar with this rule, then read it in the rulebook...  S10 hits.  Oh.  Bother.

Three S10 hits later (and one failed SS roll... sob), I have three big meat craters where once Thunderwolves stood.


Picture Caption: Hey, we traded backfields and I have the relic!

Turn 3: DE
--------------
Bloodthirster Mawseeker howled in victory, standing atop the small mound of corpses.  Blood had been spilled for the Blood God, but more would be needed.  Much more and...

"Hullo there, Beastie.  Recognize me?"

Mawseeker turned it's gaze downwards until it saw a quartet of mortals.  The one who dared adress him was an Eldar.  He could taste the blood in her veins.  Her skull would be a fine addition to...

"I take that that would be a no?  I am Lady D'ysperax.  I released you, now those Space Marines down there?  They're going to send you back.  Now, you could fight me, maybe get a skull or two, or go back there and get some fine, fine, pauldron-heavy blood-action, if you know what I... oh, I guess you do..."

Mawseeker had already taken flight in the middle of the puny creature's speech.  The tiny thing was not worth fighting.  It could make out far away the shining armor of worthy opponents.  More Skulls.  More Blood.  This he swore.
-------------

The beasts, sans beastmasters, somehow rally.  That's... not good.
They move up towards the Terminators.
Meanwhile, the Scourges come down, eying the Psycannon mate in my squad.
The Warriors rally.  Daemons move towards the Termies.
The Void Ravens turn and get ready to lay in more hurt.
Lots of S8S/9 flies at my Terminators, downing all but the Justicar and Agatha.  Thankfully, the morale check is made.


Picture Caption: Yeah... Agatha's in some trouble now.


Turn 3: SW
-------------
Calostyan's Crimson Orb.

Agatha swore to herself.  She should have known.  It was an artifact created centuries ago by a radical Inquisitor who thought to harness the Warp itself.  To somehow force Daemon to fight Daemon.  All it did was create Chaos and ruin where it went.  Calostyan was eventually hunted down, and the world he had made his lair was given the most exuberant of Extermiantus.  But, the Orb was never recovered, thought to have been destroyed in the attack.

Agatha felt the whispers of seductive voices from the infernal device and only nodded to the Justicar, who brought forth an armored box heavy with runes and protective inscriptions.  The Orb must be contained, least it fall into the wrong hands.
---------------

Agatha and the Justicar grab the relic and try to find some cover.  We shoot the Warriors to pieces.


Picture Caption: So... it's two... against a LOT.  I wonder how this will turn out...


Turn 4: DE
-------------
The Scourges leap out, ready to try and pick off the Justicar.  The Void Ravens are a bit too close, and deside to go flat out off the board.  The Bloodthirster flies ever closer.
The Scourges manage to pick off my Justicar, forcing the relic to be dropped.  Ags is charged by the remains of the beast squad, but she shoots one razorwing down via overwatch and then stabs one to pieces with her insta-killing force sword.  The rest of the beasts can't get through her 4++ (bless you force sword!) and heads off the board with their... uh... tails... tentacles... whatever between their legs.


Picture Caption: We're just sort of playing it out right now...

Turn 4: SW
-------------
Well, I have one model left, but there's vengeance to be had.

Prescience goes on for the re-rolls.

Agatha storms out, shoots up half the Scourges and assaults them, clearing them off the board.


Turn 5: DE
-------------
This is really for giggles at this point, but he strafes Agatha with both Void Bombers, but luckily she keeps making her saves.  The Bloodthirster drops in and I fire with the Psycannon on overwatch, somehow dropping it's last wound and sending it back to the Warp.


Turn 5: SW
-------------
Agatha waits to see who's got the stones to walk up next.



And at this point, my opponent tells me that it's time to wrap up, as he has this one nicely.

I'm a bit confused as I thought it was a tie, but actually, he has slay the Warlord and Linebreaker AND First Blood.  (I thought I had First Blood, but oh well...), while I only have Linebreaker.  Still, Ags went all five turns and survived, so there's something to be said for that!

Result: Dark Eldar Victory!

--------------

Post-Game Thoughts: Brutality.  That's what it was, sheer and utter brutality.  I must admit, I did get seized on and surrounded and then pounded on six ways to Sunday, but in the end, I'm not sure how to have done things differently.  I should have focused on keeping Lady D's Raider out of the castle, but I think she would have gotten in unless I fed her a squad, which she did anyway.  I need a way to deal with flyers and Flying MC's, as the Bloodthirster just tore my Thunderwolf rock to pieces without breaking a sweat.

So... yeah... unit Breakdown:

Wolf Lord: Rolf was kind of meh.  Couldn't do much and died horribly to the Bloodthirster.

Rune Priest: I so wish I could have done more, but once his squad was torn to pieces there wasn't much hope.

Grey Hunters: Decent and cheap, but couldn't again do much before they were swept away.

Thunderwolves: Died.  Horribly.  See above with Bloodthirster.

Long Fangs: Actually destroyed things.  A Venom.  Between TWO squads.  That's not great.

Inquisitor: Agatha was very good for her points.  Great powers and pretty much held her own against the entire DE army (or what was left of it) for two rounds.

Terminators: Good for giving me a last ditch effort of getting the relic.  Didn't last long though.

Having not been stomped like this in a while, it's given me a lot to reflect on.  At first, I was in denial, then sadness, anger, bargaining and then acceptance:

This isn't 5th anymore.  I need a new gameplan.

Thunderwolves don't seem viable in a world with three dimensions.  Until flyers get nerfed (if they ever will), ground forces that are assault only just don't have any hope at all.  Units that are massive in number (like Orks) or really durable (like Terminators) can weather through the fire, but small units (like MSU Space Wolves) will fall apart with not too much effort.

I've never felt so handicapped in a match before, and the "second Alpha Strike" was just so devastating I couldn't really do much in response after that.

So... rant over.  Looking for advice.  Hoping for the best.  Shelving some good looking models for now.
-------------------------

Agatha Brimstone forced her breathing to relax.  Gore and blood covered her Terminator armor, and although her displays showed that she had no significant damage, it did show that she was alone.  Horribly alone.

A high-pitched laugh brought her attention back to the field.  She had secured a position close to Calostyan's Crimson Orb.  Without the restraining box, now shattered against the Justicar's broken body, there would be no hope of containing the artifact's power.  It would only be a matter of time before the entire world fell to Chaos and the sector fell to it's whims.  She had failed.  Failed everyone and...

There was an odd sounding click, and she took a tentatively look outside to see the sinuous Eldar Archon leaning down and casually picking up the Orb with a strange looking gauntlet.  The Orb hissed and pulsed for a moment before the energies in the sky and ground receded like mist against the dawning sun.  Agatha blinked for a few seconds, to make sure it wasn't some sort of Xenos trick.  But, no, all signs of the Warp breach had disappeared.

The Archon turned towards Agatha and giggled, holding out the Orb.
"So, that was a nice demonstration.  No need to hide, if I wanted you dead, you'd be in pieces by now.  My name, little one, is Lady D'ysperax of the Wicked Talon.  You can see what my toy can do."

Agatha barked, "It is a foolish endeavor.  What you play with is madness incarnate.  It will destroy you and corrupt everything you hope to accomplish."

Lady D'ysperax nodded her head in mock contemplation.  "Oh, goodness little Mon'Keigh, you really almost convinced me there.  So sure in your fine words.  But we Eldar have a long, long record of doing the unexpected.  So hear this: If Commander Vasily Romanov is not brought to me, unharmed, I will unleash my little toy on more worlds."

Agatha paused.  "A man?  A single man?  That is all you ask for?"

The Archon tittered in response.  "This 'single man' in question is more than enough in trade.  But know that he is rather elusive.  You'll have to work hard for him.  You can collect all of your little peons now.  I'm not interested in them anymore.  I have... much bigger aspirations to attend to..."

As Lady D'ysperax walked away, Agatha shook her head.  The Xenos was mad.  Entirely mad.  But still negotiable.  Whoever this Romanov fellow was, she would hate to be in his shoes...
BigToof Points:

Cammerz: 8
Waaaghpower: 1
The Man They Call Jayne: 3
Mabbz: 6
Archon Sharrek: 3

Offline Cammerz

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Whoever this Romanov fellow was, she would hate to be in his shoes...

And she's not the only one. Its not even an IG report and I'm feeling sorry for Vasily.

Having looked at the rules for the Bloodthirster myself, I would very much like to include one in my own CSM army. No more plain summoned daemons when you can ally and get the real deal for just a sizeable amount of points.
Really I don't see how you could have won this one without extraordinary amounts of luck, although Agatha seemed to have a fair amount of it, killing a Bloodthirster like that.

Reading through your report it looks like your opponent probably did have First Blood, but not until turn 2 when the Void Ravens blew up your Razorbacks.

Clearly transport vehicles have been considereably nerfed so perhaps you should consider dropping a few things and getting a Land Raider instead, so you still get a metal box with lascannons but it might not die immediately.
And those minimum size units also might want merging so you have 1 or 2 ten-man squads, or even 15 if the wolves let you do that.

As one of your main problems appears to be taking out flying things, as much as it pains me to say, you might want to look into those Marine flyers to shoot things out of the sky. If not that then maybe have some IG allies for Hydras or make use of the Fortification slot on the FOC.

The fluff was good, especially the ending. I hope Rolf somehow manages to regenerate his nasty wounds, and Harry too. But marines tend to be quite good at that.

I'm looking forward to whatever comes next,

Job's a good un!
Ahh Cammerz has typed himself into oblivion! :o Someone get him back xD

Offline Chicop76

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Cough! Cough! He was lucky to get that placment with the Thirster. Needing 6s to ground him and him being able to assault the following turn really hurts. In 5th my thirster fell to mass rockets, assault cannons, and lascannon deah.

On average marines shoting 18 plasma will hitting 12 times wounding 8 times will be able to kill a Thrister. You only need 9 marines on average with rapid fire plasma to kill a Thirster, or 18 marines at range haha.

The Blood Thirste on a charge is str 8 unless you pay for the upgrade to make it str 9 on a charge and str 8 normal which would instant kill most models. Your best bet is in combat you need to be ws5, at least str 6, and a decent good +3 or better invlnerable save if you dare face it in combat. To make it worst is the fact it can chalenge to help beat down a unit even more.

From personal experance the only model I use to fear was the NightBringer. Now that the Nightbringer is gone I can't think of anything that can go toe to toe with a Bloodthirster. High initiative rending also causes a Thirster problems. You can try to throw some wolves at him which I think they can rend. Only problem is their low leadership:(.

Your best bet may be is to run for your life and try to ignore it. Be mobile and go for the DE models and screamers. Sure the Thrister my lay waste to half your army if you ignore it. When I get back I need to glance through the wolves and daemon hunter book.

One option that might work is take a squad of crusaders, death cult, the re roll wound or hit model that can take an evesterator. Through in a rad with psichoke with hammerhand than you may have something, but than there is challenge, so adding a character to that squad would be a bad ideal even if you can have a +2 inul save in combat. Just make sure your crusaders ar up front to eat up the wounds.

 

Offline BigToof

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Whoever this Romanov fellow was, she would hate to be in his shoes...

And she's not the only one. Its not even an IG report and I'm feeling sorry for Vasily.

Having looked at the rules for the Bloodthirster myself, I would very much like to include one in my own CSM army. No more plain summoned daemons when you can ally and get the real deal for just a sizeable amount of points.
Really I don't see how you could have won this one without extraordinary amounts of luck, although Agatha seemed to have a fair amount of it, killing a Bloodthirster like that.

Reading through your report it looks like your opponent probably did have First Blood, but not until turn 2 when the Void Ravens blew up your Razorbacks.

Clearly transport vehicles have been considereably nerfed so perhaps you should consider dropping a few things and getting a Land Raider instead, so you still get a metal box with lascannons but it might not die immediately.
And those minimum size units also might want merging so you have 1 or 2 ten-man squads, or even 15 if the wolves let you do that.

As one of your main problems appears to be taking out flying things, as much as it pains me to say, you might want to look into those Marine flyers to shoot things out of the sky. If not that then maybe have some IG allies for Hydras or make use of the Fortification slot on the FOC.

The fluff was good, especially the ending. I hope Rolf somehow manages to regenerate his nasty wounds, and Harry too. But marines tend to be quite good at that.

I'm looking forward to whatever comes next,

Job's a good un!

Thanks for the kind reply Cammerz!
I really do like the fluff as well, but I think I may need some big changes coming up.
Most obviously, I don't think the Wolves can survive without Allies in some way.
I've been thinking about it for some time, but after this game, it seems obvious.
Not really sure, although Guard does come to mind, as they offer bodies, shooting and well... I have the models and Codex already :)
I think I'm going to be taking less tanks also, as they really didn't help me in this particular game.
But the thought of Foot Wolves makes me shiver.
Perhaps the most spell-binding thing of this whole game was that past deployment, I never felt like I had control.  I was reacting the whole way, and nothing I did ever let me try to do anything than flounder around.
Never felt like that in 5th, but the fliers were just such a hard counter to what I could reasonably deal with.
In any case, Thunderwolves are not going to be used that often with me anymore, I'll tell you that much, if only that they just don't have much to charge against.  I've seen some deathstars, but T-Wolves just don't compare in terms of cost and survivability... at least... not anymore...

Cough! Cough! He was lucky to get that placment with the Thirster. Needing 6s to ground him and him being able to assault the following turn really hurts. In 5th my thirster fell to mass rockets, assault cannons, and lascannon deah.

On average marines shoting 18 plasma will hitting 12 times wounding 8 times will be able to kill a Thrister. You only need 9 marines on average with rapid fire plasma to kill a Thirster, or 18 marines at range haha.

The Blood Thirste on a charge is str 8 unless you pay for the upgrade to make it str 9 on a charge and str 8 normal which would instant kill most models. Your best bet is in combat you need to be ws5, at least str 6, and a decent good +3 or better invlnerable save if you dare face it in combat. To make it worst is the fact it can chalenge to help beat down a unit even more.

From personal experance the only model I use to fear was the NightBringer. Now that the Nightbringer is gone I can't think of anything that can go toe to toe with a Bloodthirster. High initiative rending also causes a Thirster problems. You can try to throw some wolves at him which I think they can rend. Only problem is their low leadership:(.

Your best bet may be is to run for your life and try to ignore it. Be mobile and go for the DE models and screamers. Sure the Thrister my lay waste to half your army if you ignore it. When I get back I need to glance through the wolves and daemon hunter book.

One option that might work is take a squad of crusaders, death cult, the re roll wound or hit model that can take an evesterator. Through in a rad with psichoke with hammerhand than you may have something, but than there is challenge, so adding a character to that squad would be a bad ideal even if you can have a +2 inul save in combat. Just make sure your crusaders ar up front to eat up the wounds.

Hi Chicop,
Thanks for the reply.  I've been thinking about just ignoring the Thirster, as it probably would have just gone after the Thunderwolves in any case.  It absorbed so much of my turn one shooting, I might have been safer just dealing with the more long-term goals instead of shooting it out of the sky.  I just didn't realize HOW much shooting it would take, and Marines deal with quality, not quantity of shots nowadays.
In hindsight, I kind of wonder if I shouldn't have gotten out of the transports, but I suppose that it's sort of moot as the Fliers blew them up in any case...
That Thirster though... brr...

Best,
-BT
BigToof Points:

Cammerz: 8
Waaaghpower: 1
The Man They Call Jayne: 3
Mabbz: 6
Archon Sharrek: 3

Offline Rej

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Great report, great read, I dig the fluff, and an absolutely brutal game. I love that Agatha went into overdrive at the end of the game. I'm yet to play a relic match and am looking forward to it!

And poor poor Vasily. I take it he may be vs Imperial forces soon?

Can't wait to see where the fluff goes!
Phew...

Offline crisis_vyper

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You have been having a really bad time with your Wolves lately BigToof. Maybe you need to have some drastic elements into your list to patch up the weaknesses.

Offline BigToof

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Re: Space Wolves vs Dark Eldar in "Old Friends, New Horrors" (1500, 8/11/12)
« Reply #10 on: August 18, 2012, 03:47:31 PM »
Great report, great read, I dig the fluff, and an absolutely brutal game. I love that Agatha went into overdrive at the end of the game. I'm yet to play a relic match and am looking forward to it!

And poor poor Vasily. I take it he may be vs Imperial forces soon?

Can't wait to see where the fluff goes!

Hi Rej,
Thanks for the kind comment!
I'm glad you're liking the fluff and Vasily may be having encounters with non-Xenos soon... :)
The game was pretty brutal, if mostly from my end.

You have been having a really bad time with your Wolves lately BigToof. Maybe you need to have some drastic elements into your list to patch up the weaknesses.

Hi Crisis,
Glad you commented.  I'm still trying to wrap my head around the DE list.
It just... seems like it was so weak, but I got rolled.
The fliers were the killer part, and now I see that the entire list is about keeping you from moving around until turn 2 when you get bombarded.
Perhaps that's the thing that's missing most from my list is mobility... and better placement.
But I find that Marines in general have difficulty with mobility, at least compared to what I'm used to.
I've considered using Drop Pods, but that might make things worse, as then you're tied to a point on the board until you get killed...
Just need to cogitate more I guess.
.
..
...
On the other hand, I could have just played to kill his two little troops hiding in the back and then just try to survive until the end of the game...  Is this the new Marine mindset?

Best,
-BT
BigToof Points:

Cammerz: 8
Waaaghpower: 1
The Man They Call Jayne: 3
Mabbz: 6
Archon Sharrek: 3

Offline crisis_vyper

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Re: Space Wolves vs Dark Eldar in "Old Friends, New Horrors" (1500, 8/11/12)
« Reply #11 on: August 18, 2012, 06:20:33 PM »
Hi Crisis,
Glad you commented.  I'm still trying to wrap my head around the DE list.
It just... seems like it was so weak, but I got rolled.
The fliers were the killer part, and now I see that the entire list is about keeping you from moving around until turn 2 when you get bombarded.
Perhaps that's the thing that's missing most from my list is mobility... and better placement.
But I find that Marines in general have difficulty with mobility, at least compared to what I'm used to.
I've considered using Drop Pods, but that might make things worse, as then you're tied to a point on the board until you get killed...
Just need to cogitate more I guess.
.
..
...
On the other hand, I could have just played to kill his two little troops hiding in the back and then just try to survive until the end of the game...  Is this the new Marine mindset?

The DE/Daemon list works because it has several large threats that prevent you from shooting the little guys. You were lucky that he did not take Flamers, or else your entire army will be much worse off as a result of the way you deployed your wolves and their vehicles. Glancing hits, flamer with no cover or armour saves.....it is a true pain indeed (but that is why I love them). I for one think that the DE/Daemon list is quite well done, just that I do not like the idea of having to roll the "Turning One Eye" all the time.

I think the issue here with your list is that you are static either way and you do not have a Beta Strike.

My personal opinion of playing with Wolves is just playing a mix of Drop Pods and Razorbacks with a lot of Land Speeders with Assault Cannons and/or Typhoons. The Thunderwolves are gimmicky in my opinion and the Wolves are better off with their complements of Grey Hunters  and Long Fangs (or maybe even some Wolf Guard (Termies or normal ones)  if you are at it.)

Offline BigToof

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Re: Space Wolves vs Dark Eldar in "Old Friends, New Horrors" (1500, 8/11/12)
« Reply #12 on: August 19, 2012, 09:28:10 PM »
Hi Crisis,
Glad you commented.  I'm still trying to wrap my head around the DE list.
It just... seems like it was so weak, but I got rolled.
The fliers were the killer part, and now I see that the entire list is about keeping you from moving around until turn 2 when you get bombarded.
Perhaps that's the thing that's missing most from my list is mobility... and better placement.
But I find that Marines in general have difficulty with mobility, at least compared to what I'm used to.
I've considered using Drop Pods, but that might make things worse, as then you're tied to a point on the board until you get killed...
Just need to cogitate more I guess.
.
..
...
On the other hand, I could have just played to kill his two little troops hiding in the back and then just try to survive until the end of the game...  Is this the new Marine mindset?

The DE/Daemon list works because it has several large threats that prevent you from shooting the little guys. You were lucky that he did not take Flamers, or else your entire army will be much worse off as a result of the way you deployed your wolves and their vehicles. Glancing hits, flamer with no cover or armour saves.....it is a true pain indeed (but that is why I love them). I for one think that the DE/Daemon list is quite well done, just that I do not like the idea of having to roll the "Turning One Eye" all the time.

I think the issue here with your list is that you are static either way and you do not have a Beta Strike.

My personal opinion of playing with Wolves is just playing a mix of Drop Pods and Razorbacks with a lot of Land Speeders with Assault Cannons and/or Typhoons. The Thunderwolves are gimmicky in my opinion and the Wolves are better off with their complements of Grey Hunters  and Long Fangs (or maybe even some Wolf Guard (Termies or normal ones)  if you are at it.)

Hi Crisis,
I think you're pretty dead on with your assessment.  The T-wolves have been sorely lacking and only performed in 5th when I had a decent deathstar to throw at.
Flamers would have been... bad, I admit.
I think it's time to start thinking laterally.
I am really considering adding in IG to help with anti-flier tech and also more bodies and shootiness.
Was also considering Blood Angels, but I don't know enough about them.
Maybe I've played DE so long it's hard to consider armies from other points of view  :)

Best,
-BT
BigToof Points:

Cammerz: 8
Waaaghpower: 1
The Man They Call Jayne: 3
Mabbz: 6
Archon Sharrek: 3

 

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